# Should I feel guilty for hating Christmas?



## Misfit

Everything seems to say Christmas is the best time of year.  Jesus was born to save everybody, Santa brings the kids presents. My TV has Claymation snowmen, Winter Warlock’s and the Abominable Snowman all over the place. Every commercial has a happy family’s sitting around a fireplace giving each other stuff, laughing… or a good looking couple in love sharing romantic moments. Meanwhile every year I mope around grumbly and sad. I did have some significant life moments occur around this time of year. When I was a kid one of my best friend’s house caught fire and he died a couple days before Christmas and I always remember my parents fighting around the holidays.  The great Thanksgiving brawl of 1983 sticks out vividly, but I still like turkey day. :shrug:

Anyhoo, I feel guilty for not liking this time of year and I wish it was spring.


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## Larry Gude

Depends on what Christmas means to YOU. 

I HATE black Friday and feel like it is this sick thing but, it doesn't ruin Thanksgiving for me because Thanksgiving, for me, is the meal and the people I don't see very often and the mood and the conversation. I hate the commercial aspects of Christmas and the whole thing has long been hard to swallow; Christ's Birthday, so, let's have some super hero fat guy do the impossible with a sled, flying reindeer and hit every house in the world with toys to celebrate our savior. 

So, I get into the kid aspect and the family gathering part. I mean, we're always looking for reasons to celebrate. So, is it really all that absurd, the Christ birthday, Santa thing? I mean, it is but, we're people so, what's not absurd?   

if you need deeper meaning, the winter solstice is real and it does have physiological effects on us so, there is that.


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## Amused_despair

I tend to feel guilty if I have a disparaging thought about someone I do not even know, a thought that I never vocalize but just keep in my head.  Since Jesus' birthday was probably in the Spring or Summer time and we actually celebrate the birthday of the bull god Mithra on December 25 I think you are OK in not having a love affair with Christmas.  Many people, myself included, have had bad things happen this time of year which tends to  sour our happy-happy-joy-joy outlook on the festive season.  I am not a big fan of turkey and cranberry sauce so Thanksgiving isn't a big holiday to me.  I prefer the traditional chili-making holiday of St. Patrick's Day.  I try to keep the joy of Christmas for the little kids and my immediate family and keep a positive outlook.  I enjoy baking cookies so this is by tradition the perfect time for baking goods for others so that they too may become overweight like me.  It is the gift of sharing


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## BadGirl

I hate Christmas, too.  It wouldn't be hard for me to completely ignore it, but I have a son to think of, so despite what I feel about it, I feel like I have to do something for him.

I immensely dislike the music, the "Season's Greetings" messages, and I hate, hate, hate the presents - buying them, wrapping them, giving them, getting them, and paying for them.   To date, I haven't bought the first present, and I really hope that I don't break down and buy one - I didn't buy any last year, and it felt great to not have that stress on my shoulders.

I wish I could just fast-forward through the next two weeks.


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## Chasey_Lane

I miss the "old" Christmas where people actually took the time to celebrate the true meaning of it.


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## Dakota

Chasey_Lane said:


> I miss the "old" Christmas where people actually took the time to celebrate the true meaning of it.



Old Christmas to me is when I was a kid.  Now those were the days.  I got yummy treats and gifts and didn't have to deal with the expense or effort.


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## Misfit

My wife decorates the house like Santa’s village and it makes me want to cut my wrists with a shard of Christmas bulb. I end up cleaning up tinsel for 6 months. It gets tied up in the vacuum cleaner bristles and I always end up trying to find a stick outside to get the glittering string of poop that’s dangling from the dogs butt while he’s looking at me with his help me face, plus I always  end up eating and drinking too much so I’m always hung over with heart burn. None of this happens during Halloween.


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## MMDad

I used to hate Christmas with the commercialization, crowds, and hypocrisy. But I've figured out how to minimize my exposure to the negatives and only experience it the way I want to. I used to feel obligated to go to the parties where all the coworkers who hate each other during the day pretend to be friends as they get falling down drunk. Now I just spend some time with the kids. I don't wait in long lines for a poor imitation Santa.

But I completely understand the hate of Christmas, as contacts with certain family members remind me of just how dysfunctional some of those "happy holidays" can be. I'm just glad they are 2,000 miles away.


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## Bay_Kat

Misfit said:


> My wife decorates the house like Santa’s village and it makes me want to cut my wrists with a shard of Christmas bulb. I end up cleaning up tinsel for 6 months. It gets tied up in the vacuum cleaner bristles and *I always end up trying to find a stick outside to get the glittering string of poop that’s dangling from the dogs butt while he’s looking at me with his help me face*, plus I always  end up eating and drinking too much so I’m always hung over with heart burn. None of this happens during Halloween.



Okay, I had to laugh at this.  Sorry.


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## vraiblonde

The Grinch hated Christmas, the whole Christmas season.  Now please don't ask why, no one quite knows the reason....



BadGirl said:


> I immensely dislike the music, the "Season's Greetings" messages, and I hate, hate, hate the presents - buying them, wrapping them, giving them, getting them, and paying for them.   To date, I haven't bought the first present, and I really hope that I don't break down and buy one - I didn't buy any last year, and it felt great to not have that stress on my shoulders.



This always surprises me about you because you're so generous, love to celebrate and cook, and are so into your family.  You should be a natural for Christmas.

Have you always hated Christmas or is this something that came on as an adult?


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## DQ2B

If I didn't have kids, I would let the holidays pass as any other day.


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## BadGirl

vraiblonde said:


> The Grinch hated Christmas, the whole Christmas season.  Now please don't ask why, no one quite knows the reason....
> 
> 
> 
> This always surprises me about you because you're so generous, love to celebrate and cook, and are so into your family.  You should be a natural for Christmas.
> 
> Have you always hated Christmas or is this something that came on as an adult?


But see, for the reasons you mention, is why I LOVE LOVE LOVE Thanksgiving.  I get to have all of the cool family togetherness (and I do ADORE my family), but I get to have all of that without the pressure of buying presents and going in to debt to do it.

I don't have wonderful memories of Christmas as a kid (but don't think I had a crappy Christmas....I just have very few memories of a kid in general).  I do think that my Christmas tree is beautiful.  

I guess my frustration with Christmas is borne from disappointment:  from getting presents that I don't need/want/like, to giving presents that were an ill-fit for the recipient, despite me making my best effort to find the perfect gift.  And the idea of buying presents for people I don't even like just pisses me off.  I do best if I can just totally avoid the present giving/getting part of the holiday.  BUT, I do like to grab something off of my shelves that I've made (homemade jelly/jams/pickles,etc) and just give it to someone who would appreciate it .... with no expectation of getting something in return.   

There is also so much frenzy involved in Christmas.  I get super-involved for Thanksgiving, that by the time Christmas comes around, I am just burnt out and I feel like I have nothing to celebrate.  All I want to do is rest, watch really bad Lifetime movies on tv, eat deliciously 'bad' food, and nap when I want, and - generally - just have a lazy day.

Fundamentally, I just hate spending money, and shopping gives me great anxiety.  And let's not even talk about all of the crowds that make me cringe.  The NOISE!  The PUSHING!  The KIDS SCREAMING!  The FULL PARKING LOTS!  The ARMS FULL OF PACKAGES THAT I HATE CARRYING AROUND!  All of that just totally sucks for me; I have no joy in it at all.

If I just skip the present aspect of Christmas, I think I'd like it a whole lot better.


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## LostNFound

For some reason Ive come around and like it again. For most of my adult life I did not. I wont beat a dead horse- but xmas has NEVER meant someone's bday for me. I grew up without religion and find the stories laughable and have yet to meet anyone that humbly celebrates xmas, like the stories say people once did or should. I dont like hearing from other parents the long list of brand name garbage they bought their kids, so little of it needful things- more like wants.  It saddens me to hear from friends the fights the grandparents have over whose house the kids will open presents at first. The stores stuffed with china made crap no one needs but people clamor for like its some sort of emergency. 

We just did a gift exchange at work -$10 max- and IMO- we all should have banded together and gave that money to a food pantry- not trade around mugs, candles and gift cards (again- no one needs or barely wants)

There is a lot more wrong with xmas IMO, that I could name- but I am thankful that over the years my family has found a way to enjoy this season. Id rather be somewhere warm, Id rather the world gave up on religion, Id rather we gave to those in need more than we as humans do.... 

However, my children have learned to be very thankful for small tokens. They give to each other generously and ask for so little. We get a day or 2 or 3 off (4 this year!) that we spend together eating great food, with no pressures to get anywhere fast. We reconnect and are thankful for the day marked on the calender that says Stay Home-Enjoy Each Other- (your calender probably simply says...Christmas)


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## PsyOps

Misfit said:


> Everything seems to say Christmas is the best time of year.  Jesus was born to save everybody, Santa brings the kids presents. My TV has Claymation snowmen, Winter Warlock’s and the Abominable Snowman all over the place. Every commercial has a happy family’s sitting around a fireplace giving each other stuff, laughing… or a good looking couple in love sharing romantic moments. Meanwhile every year I mope around grumbly and sad. I did have some significant life moments occur around this time of year. When I was a kid one of my best friend’s house caught fire and he died a couple days before Christmas and I always remember my parents fighting around the holidays.  The great Thanksgiving brawl of 1983 sticks out vividly, but I still like turkey day. :shrug:
> 
> Anyhoo, I feel guilty for not liking this time of year and I wish it was spring.



Go find someone truly in need and buy them something, make them a dinner, something... Send something to one of our troops:

https://operationshoebox.com/

http://www.christmasforourtroops.org/

http://www.treesfortroops.org/dnn/default.aspx

You'll feel better, I promise.


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## kwillia

BadGirl said:


> I don't have wonderful memories of Christmas as a kid (but don't think I had a crappy Christmas....I just have very few memories of a kid in general).


And this ^ is why I'm very glad you haven't chosen to totally ignore the Christmas holiday. The traditions you and itsbob chose to put in place will carry on as memories and set the basis for how your son looks at Christmas and handles it when he has a family of his own or a S/O that he'll be expected to share the holidays with long after he leaves you two and has his life of his own.

My immediate family has unconventional traditions when it comes to the various holidays. My husband's family is very traditional and family oriented for ALL of the holidays. My kids are exposed to both and as a result I see them react to both sides of the fence and am watching them come to conclusions on their own about what they'll carry forward in life.

Memories fade and get twisted with time... the efforts you put in now during his developing years will be the legacy you two leave with him forever.

Merry Christmas, Happy New Year, etc...


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## Misfit

PsyOps said:


> Go find someone truly in need and buy them something, make them a dinner, something... Send something to one of our troops:
> 
> https://operationshoebox.com/
> 
> http://www.christmasforourtroops.org/
> 
> http://www.treesfortroops.org/dnn/default.aspx
> 
> You'll feel better, I promise.



I volunteered at the soup kitchen for almost a year but got discouraged serving people with base badges. I see what you're getting at though. A selfless service might change my focus.


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## vraiblonde

BadGirl said:


> Fundamentally, I just hate spending money, and shopping gives me great anxiety.  And let's not even talk about all of the crowds that make me cringe.  The NOISE!  The PUSHING!  The KIDS SCREAMING!  The FULL PARKING LOTS!  The ARMS FULL OF PACKAGES THAT I HATE CARRYING AROUND!  All of that just totally sucks for me; I have no joy in it at all.
> 
> If I just skip the present aspect of Christmas, I think I'd like it a whole lot better.



aHA!

See, I don't do that - buy a lot of crap for people who don't want or need it.  I buy for my kids, my grands, and my folks and that's it.  Neal and I stocking stuffed for each other, and I put goodies in Apollo's stocking.  Most was bought online while I sipped a cup of cinnamon coffee.  Zero frenzy.

I do not understand the attraction to Black Friday shopping and going into debt buying a bunch of stuff for everyone you know, but tons of people do it every year.

Nuts.

I'm more into the nice part of Christmas, where you smile and greet people you'd normally ignore.  I like saying "Merry Christmas" to the checker at Target and having her say it back to me.  I like Christmas carols.  I LOVE! getting newsy brag letters from friends in my Christmas card.  I like all the parties and happy hours.  I like how the apartment looks all decorated and festive.

But I agree with Misfit - tinsel was invented by Satan.  I didn't think anyone even did that nonsense anymore.


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## vraiblonde

PsyOps said:


> Go find someone truly in need and buy them something, make them a dinner, something... Send something to one of our troops:
> 
> https://operationshoebox.com/
> 
> http://www.christmasforourtroops.org/
> 
> http://www.treesfortroops.org/dnn/default.aspx
> 
> You'll feel better, I promise.



And let me plug my Christmas charity recipient, Fisher House.    The money that I've never spent buying crazy expensive junk for my kids and friends, that's where it goes.


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## PsyOps

vraiblonde said:


> And let me plug my Christmas charity recipient, Fisher House.    The money that I've never spent buying crazy expensive junk for my kids and friends, that's where it goes.



Always Fisher House.  And the Wounded Warrior Project


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## RoseRed

Misfit said:


> I volunteered at the soup kitchen for almost a year but got discouraged *serving people with base badges*. I see what you're getting at though. A selfless service might change my focus.



Really?  Professionals or service workers?


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## Misfit

RoseRed said:


> Really?  Professionals or service workers?



Professionals, more than just one, they used to get a table together. I don't know if it still happens but it soured me on that gig.


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## itsbob

Larry Gude said:


> Depends on what Christmas means to YOU.
> 
> I HATE black Friday


Racist


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## itsbob

vraiblonde said:


> And let me plug my Christmas charity recipient, Fisher House.    The money that I've never spent buying crazy expensive junk for my kids and friends, that's where it goes.



St Judes...


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## Bay_Kat

My husband has always disliked Christmas, not sure why.  This year though he actually seems to be into it.  He even bought a big red bow for the front of the Jeep.  He's been away several Christmas' in a row and maybe that has something to do with it, being home for a change.


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## MMDad

BadGirl said:


> There is also so much frenzy involved in Christmas.  I get super-involved for Thanksgiving, that by the time Christmas comes around, I am just burnt out and I feel like I have nothing to celebrate.  All I want to do is rest, watch really bad Lifetime movies on tv, eat deliciously 'bad' food, and nap when I want, and - generally - just have a lazy day.



A lot of people believe that you have to be all-in for Christmas. If you don't hang lights, don't have the biggest tree, don't send cards, etc. you aren't doing it right. That's why I used to hate it. But now I only do the parts I want and it's much more enjoyable.

I only bought presents for my kids, our dog, and my dad. I don't expect much in return, and will not be disappointed.

We don't go to a bunch of events to listen to crappy music we don't really enjoy. But we will go to Tubachristmas in Solomons on Sunday.

I don't do the "traditional" Christmas dinner - I let the kids choose their favorites and will cook a meal that makes us happy.

It's a balance thing. Pick the parts you want to do, skip the rest, and ignore anyone who thinks you aren't doing it right.


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## RoseRed

Misfit said:


> Professionals, more than just one, they used to get a table together. I don't know if it still happens but it soured me on that gig.



They should be ashamed of themselves.


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## Christy

BadGirl said:


> to giving presents that were an ill-fit for the recipient, despite me making my best effort to find the perfect gift.



Well if it is any consolation Scrooge McBadGirl, the Christmas ornament you gave me many years ago as a gift still brings me joy every single year. 

I don't think anyone should feel bad for hating Christmas, but it makes me sad that people do, because it always makes me so happy.  I don't ever remember having a bad Christmas, no matter how bad things were in my life at any given time, Christmas was just a time to forget about it all and have hope for the future. I've always felt that Christmas, whether you are Christian or not, represents hope, rebirth and a sense that anything is possible.  I mean you look at a newborn, and to me, that's a clean slate right there. It is pure and full of great potential.  I think every year we should view our own lives in that sense.  JMHO. :shrug:


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## vraiblonde

MMDad said:


> It's a balance thing. Pick the parts you want to do, skip the rest, and ignore anyone who thinks you aren't doing it right.



Just like that  

On Christmas Eve and when we put up the tree, we had "junk food" dinner.  We'd go to the store and each kid could pick one or two junk foods, then we'd put it all out and eat buffet style.  Cookies, chips, smokies, squeeze cheese, frozen snackies - whatever they thought sounded good.  It was always fun.


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## Roman

Even as a Child, I didn't care for Christmas. It was a depressing time of year, especially for my Mother. She was the only child, and we lived far from her Mother. I remember her Mother (my Grandmother) calling on Christmas day, speaking to each of us to find out what my Dad's parents got us. She'd revel in the thought that she got us the "best" gifts. Even as a child, I hated that. I even remember arguments about that. If there was a favorite part of Christmas for me, it was the tree, and the snow. That's about it.
As an adult, my Husband worked seven days a week, up to 16 hours a day providing for the family. I was a Student, and didn't work outside the home. I did everything from putting up the tree, to shopping & wrapping, as well as the cooking. We had two Children, so I made the best ever effort to make Christmas very special for them. I was a great actress, and both our Children LOVE Christmas, and carry on some of the traditions that I made as time went along. I'm proud of that. Now that they are grown, and out of the house, I no longer decorate. To me Christmas is a big lie. Though I am not a religious person, Jesus was not born December 25. From what I know, he was born in June. Forgive me if I'm wrong. We teach our Children not to lie, but it's OK for us to lie about there being a Santa, who brings gifts to all the good little boys & girls.? I find that disgusting. There were times we couldn't afford to buy the kids what they wanted, and it broke our hearts. So forgive my bahumbug attitude. My true celebration is when it's all over.


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## vraiblonde

Misfit said:


> Professionals, more than just one, they used to get a table together. I don't know if it still happens but it soured me on that gig.



Think about it:  who would have dinner at a soup kitchen if they had friends and family they could be with?  I'd more feel sympathy for them and be pleased that they were able to come be with other people for Christmas dinner.

When my first husband was in the Army a group of us used to have Orphan Christmas (and Thanksgiving).  All the peeps in the barracks were invited and we'd make a huge feast at whoever had the biggest home.  The guys would put up flyers and spread the word.  The base started kicking in food, so we'd get a sack of potatoes and a turkey, some stuffing mix, canned veggies and like that to offset the cost of feeding everyone.  It was pretty cool.


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## kwillia

Roman said:


> Even as a Child, I didn't care for Christmas. It was a depressing time of year, especially for my Mother. She was the only child, and we lived far from her Mother. I remember her Mother (my Grandmother) calling on Christmas day, speaking to each of us to find out what my Dad's parents got us. She'd revel in the thought that she got us the "best" gifts. Even as a child, I hated that. I even remember arguments about that. If there was a favorite part of Christmas for me, it was the tree, and the snow. That's about it.
> As an adult, my Husband worked seven days a week, up to 16 hours a day providing for the family. I was a Student, and didn't work outside the home. I did everything from putting up the tree, to shopping & wrapping, as well as the cooking. We had two Children, so I made the best ever effort to make Christmas very special for them. I was a great actress, and both our Children LOVE Christmas, and carry on some of the traditions that I made as time went along. I'm proud of that. Now that they are grown, and out of the house, I no longer decorate. To me Christmas is a big lie. Though I am not a religious person, Jesus was not born December 25. From what I know, he was born in June. Forgive me if I'm wrong. We teach our Children not to lie, but it's OK for us to lie about there being a Santa, who brings gifts to all the good little boys & girls.? I find that disgusting. There were times we couldn't afford to buy the kids what they wanted, and it broke our hearts. So forgive my bahumbug attitude. My true celebration is when it's all over.



I'll be 110% honest with you, now that my kids have reached young adulthood they've both informed me their cherished Christmas memories are not at all about any gift they ever received, but rather the time spent together.  It was a big eye opener to hear them say that and I had to stop and realize that when I think back about my Christmases past it's not the gifts I'm thinking about either. 

I admit it's been since this epiphany two Christmases ago that I've truly embraced the winter holiday season and now it's something I look forward to and cherish without the stresses I've always put on myself in the past.


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## Misfit

vraiblonde said:


> Think about it:  who would have dinner at a soup kitchen if they had friends and family they could be with?  I'd more feel sympathy for them and be pleased that they were able to come be with other people for Christmas dinner.



Sorry, I should have been clearer. I volunteered M-F daily during my lunch hour for a year .


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## BadGirl

Misfit said:


> Sorry, I should have been clearer. I volunteered M-F daily during my lunch hour for a year .



You are much nicer than I was giving you credit for.


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## itsbob

Misfit said:


> Everything seems to say Christmas is the best time of year.



That's the perception they want to make, but isn't it also the highest rate of suicide time of year?

If you're single, have no family (local anyways) I can imagine this time of year sucks out loud.


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## vraiblonde

itsbob said:


> If you're single, have no family (local anyways) I can imagine this time of year sucks out loud.



I have been single and had no local family for the last 7 years, and the holidays have never sucked for me.


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## Roman

itsbob said:


> That's the perception they want to make, but isn't it also the highest rate of suicide time of year?
> 
> If you're single, have no family (local anyways) I can imagine this time of year sucks out loud.


When I was a Paramedic, suicides were prevalent from October, until about mid-January.


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## MMDad

itsbob said:


> That's the perception they want to make, but isn't it also the highest rate of suicide time of year?
> 
> If you're single, have no family (local anyways) I can imagine this time of year sucks out loud.



If your family sucks, not being local is a good thing. I haven't spent Christmas with my mom since 1990, and it is much more pleasant this way.

Part of the depression is supposedly due to the short days, with the shortest being just 3-5 days before Christmas. I think the other huge part is people not being able to live up to their own expectations or being disappointed in the people around them.


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## RoseRed

http://wtkr.com/2014/12/17/dad-gives-kids-terrible-christmas-presents-watch-their-reactions/


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## Amused_despair

itsbob said:


> That's the perception they want to make, but isn't it also the highest rate of suicide time of year?
> 
> If you're single, have no family (local anyways) I can imagine this time of year sucks out loud.



When I was in the Navy I remember training that said that January and February were worse months for suicide and depression than December.


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## Misfit

RoseRed said:


> http://wtkr.com/2014/12/17/dad-gives-kids-terrible-christmas-presents-watch-their-reactions/



Thank you for my b-a-n-a-n-a.


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## vraiblonde

RoseRed said:


> http://wtkr.com/2014/12/17/dad-gives-kids-terrible-christmas-presents-watch-their-reactions/



Man, some of those kids need spankings.


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## itsbob

vraiblonde said:


> I have been single and had no local family for the last 7 years, and the holidays have never sucked for me.


That's because you have a heart of coal..


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## acommondisaster

I just feel we put it on ourselves. So wrapped up in making sure it's awesome and special and everyone gets the perfect gift, we put so much pressure on ourselves. In Christmases past, I stressed and overspent. I wanted to be sure the kids were happy and had enough and equal number of presents that cost about the same amount under the tree. We spent months paying the credit card bills. There were clothes I bought them that I never saw worn, and I'd know that when I bought it, but if I bought one a sweater, I'd better buy them all sweaters.

Frankly, I couldn't tell you what anyone gave me for Christmas the year before (except my husband, because he ALWAYS gets me a sweater and some jammies). But I CAN tell you what we had for dinner and who was here and I remember the fun we had playing board games after dinner.  So a couple of years ago we started drastically dialing back on the Christmas "giving". I spend a couple of hours online ordering presents and except for the wrapping, I'm done. No one seems terribly disappointed that the living room isn't one big pile of presents anymore. 

I'm glad we've cut all of that out, glad I'm not going crazy decorating  (just two trees and a couple of table decorations, but none of that crazy decorating the house like we live at the North Pole anymore). I actually have time (when I'm not working) for candlelight service at church - I used to be too exhausted, or busy wrapping presents to go.  The pressure's off.  I'm having a tough time convincing my DIL that Santa really only needs to bring or or two of their big items on their lists and that a few things from 5 Below and they'll be happy as clams -she's still of the mind that Santa's not a good elf and they'll be disappointed if they don't get everything on their lists, but I'm hopeful she'll come around to my way of thinking; her family's still big on STUFF.


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## MMDad

Amused_despair said:


> When I was in the Navy I remember training that said that January and February were worse months for suicide and depression than December.



Oddly enough, the CDC data points to February being lowest for suicides and the summer months being highest. So much for the common perception.


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## Larry Gude

MMDad said:


> Oddly enough, the CDC data points to February being lowest for suicides and the summer months being highest. So much for the common perception.



Not odd. February is my and Badgirls birthday month. Everyone loves her and most people adore me. Except the ones who wish I was dead. Plus, more ice cream is eaten in February than any other month. By far. 
Ice cream makes people happy, happy people don't suck start .45's therefore people who exist in the bliss that IS February do NOT off themselves. 

BG, take a bow, baby!   We just rawk and we can't help it.


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## Larry Gude

itsbob said:


> That's because you have a heart of coal..



That's bull####. She has one of the bigger hearts I've ever known. Yeah, she's a little cranky and crabby here and there but, she has a beautiful soul and is absolutely one of the good people. When she's not being...

[video=youtube;2hXgAYku2PA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2hXgAYku2PA[/video]


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## Monello

itsbob said:


> That's because you have a heart of coal..



Isn't that a Neil Young song?


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## Larry Gude

Monello said:


> Isn't that a Neil Young song?


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## kom526

I LOVE Christmas and the older I get the more I love it. What I don't love is Commercial-mas. When the LW and I first started dating, I had no money to buy presents for my family, much for hers. I ended up stuffing a ham as my present to them and now that is the tradition. We have these wonderful new neighbors that love to just socialize (read: drink and nosh) and to us, being able to share our kids enthusiasm and wonder with them (older kids out of house mostly) makes all of us happy. This year, my oldest son will be playing violin at Christmas Eve Mass so that has really ramped it up for us. 

You get out of Christmas what you put into it. I'm not talking about buying a boatload of unappreciated gifts and making nice to folks you wouldn't throw a line to if they were drowning, I'm talking about refusing to let yourself get caught up on what the commercials tell you what you need to buy to make Christmas special. I am by no means the poster child for my Catholicism but I do remain steadfast in my belief of the 'reason for the season', and as I gracefully age I tend to embrace that more and more.


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## FollowTheMoney

I *LOVE* Christmas: Giving to someone who genuinely had no expectation of receiving something. The look, the confusion, the flushing, the watery eyes.       Being the, "don't touch the presents till Dad gets out of bed" Dad. Answering back "Merry Christmas" to someone who just said "Happy Holiday".  Giving a helping hand to someone who has helped themselves. _(See first sentence)_ Receiving enough socks and underwear to last the coming year. : ) Adding another tie to the collection. The love. The love of Life.

Add yours:.........



I *HATE* Christmas: The expectation that you must give something. The gift card. The, "do you happen to still have the receipt?" question. That look of, "what am I going to do with this, what was he/she thinking?", then "oh thank you, it's perfect (BS)" response.  The vanity, selfishness and shallowness. The hate.


Add yours:........


----------



## kwillia

I accidently switched the TV channel to the Michael Buble' Christmas special last night and fro'd up a little in my mouf. He could be a reason so many are starting to dislike Christmas.


----------



## Bann

Honestly, I don't know why the time of year sucks for anyone.  I am not being mean, or nasty.  I just think that it really is what you make of it.  If you don't have good memories of Christmas as a child - make them now.  IF YOU WANT TO.  If you don't want to, there's no reason to.  There's no reason you should feel bad, there's no one to make you.  It can be the time of year that you want it to be.  Seriously.

DON'T go into debt for Christmas.  I guess if you can afford to do whatever, then you can do it, but I never, ever thought that way.  Don't buy lots of presents that you cannot afford - no one forces you do. I have never, not once in my life spent more money than I had cash for on Christmas.  I just didn't believe that way.

Here's an example I experienced:
My Ex husband had a really sh*tty attitude every year at Christmas.  (I didn't know him long enough when we got married and I take full responsibility for that. On our first married Christmas he was very much a humbug and that took me  by surprise, as I never was and didn't know anyone who was).  I came to realize that his father was an abusive alcoholic who was always in a BAR on Christmas Eve.  (The wonderful practicing, church-going Lutheran Christian that he was).  One year my Ex apparently got sent to the bar on his bicycle to go get his dad.  #1 I blame his MOTHER for sending him - she was an idiot from the word go for putting up with the father and letting him abuse her children. (A police 911 dispatcher, she was)  #2) the dad was an alcoholic drunk  #3)my Ex would not get the proper counseling he needed to in order to deal with this, among a myriad of other issues.  (which is part of why we are now divorced)

HOWEVER, I had pretty good memories of Christmas, and even tho the EX was a butthead, I made sure my kids had nice memories every year.  I buy them ornaments every year so they will remember each one that was given to them and the meaning of it. I have always baked, and we decorate the tree together, with Christmas carols** that I have played since they were small.  We don't but a crap TON OF PRESENTS, so they don't remember having a LOT, but they remember having things they appreciated and used.  I have tried really hard to create those memories in an attempt to make their world special.   I did that for me and for them, though.

I don't believe it's my job to make people (in general) like Christmas, though.  They either do or they don't and I just choose to like it.  

*the boys are grown now with "their own stuff to do & jobs" and this year we decorated the tree in stages.


----------



## migtig

I always loved Christmas, always.  I grew up poor and I remember almost every single Christmas gift.  I'd get a present from Santa - something that I had been wanting and wishing for all year - one year it was a hula hoop - don't judge; a present from my Dad - some mix of socks, underwear, pjs, school clothes; a present from my grandmother - always something homemade - I still have one of the dolls she made me; a present from my grandfather (different side of my family) - always a Barbie Doll.  When my Mom was alive I'd get weird random things that were always fun at the time.  My Aunt continued that and I think my absolute favorite gift from her was a pink parasol.  I loved Christmas.  It was about hope, and new beginnings, and food, and friends, and all that.  

As an adult, far from home, with no immediate family, I still loved Christmas.  I always put up a tree.  I always bought or made gifts that said I was thinking of you.  I always mailed Christmas cards.  I always had a blast, even if I spent Christmas alone with my dog.  

Then I married my husband.    I fcking hate Christmas.  Christmas has become a soul sucking holiday.  I hate decorating.  I hate buying gifts.  I hate unappreciative jerk wads who want something expensive and can't be bothered to write a thank you note.  It's all about the biggest price tag.  Nobody likes "homemade" gifts" because they are "cheap".  (In no way is anything I make "cheap).  It's all about "me me me".  It's all about spending money on people who can't even be bothered to mail a Christmas card. They don't even cook!  Worst sin ever in my book.  Worst Christmas ever was spent with foul mouthed children with parents who refused to correct them, eating the nastiest cold congealed food I have ever had in my life.   I fcking hate Christmas.  My first Christmas with my husband, even he didn't appreciate my inexpensive thoughtful gifts.  They were shoved in a bag and I've never seen them again. My gifts from him were a bunch of "expensive" items I didn't want or need.  So every year, I buy him some gawdawful expensive price tag gift and hate myself for doing it.  

I fcking hate Christmas.  It's not about what I thought it was about.  

I'm with Roman, Jesus was born in the early summer and Christmas was all about co-opting a pagan holiday in order to get converts.


----------



## RoseRed

kwillia said:


> I accidently switched the TV channel to the Michael Buble' Christmas special last night and fro'd up a little in my mouf. He could be a reason so many are starting to dislike Christmas.



Good to know that I am not the only one who doesn't appreciate his crooning.


----------



## lovinmaryland

kwillia said:


> I accidently switched the TV channel to the Michael Buble' Christmas special last night and fro'd up a little in my mouf. He could be a reason so many are starting to dislike Christmas.



WHAT


----------



## kwillia

lovinmaryland said:


> WHAT


I looked up "smarmy" in the dictionary and they had his picture there...


----------



## lovinmaryland

kwillia said:


> I looked up "smarmy" in the dictionary and they had his picture there...



He is amazingly talented!  I dont know why they had anyone else perform on his special...he outshined them all! 

My daughter looked at me halfway through the show and said "you can have Dad Mom...Michael Buble is my new boyfriend"  :swoon:


----------



## kwillia

lovinmaryland said:


> He is amazingly talented!  I dont know why they had anyone else perform on his special...he outshined them all!
> 
> My daughter looked at me halfway through the show and said "you can have Dad Mom...Michael Buble is my new boyfriend"  :swoon:


I honestly tried to watch just to see what you Buble'baes see in him but I could never make it through an entire song without having to turn it!


----------



## vraiblonde

Bann said:


> If you don't have good memories of Christmas as a child - make them now.



It's never too late to have a happy childhood.  

The general theme is that greed and commercialization have ruined Christmas.  It's become a gift competition instead of a time for friends, family, and festivity.  It's not Christmas itself that you hate, it's the humans involved in Christmas that suck.

But, as Bann said, you don't have to take part in that.  If you gift someone something modest and/or homemade and they snub it, that's on them and speaks to their bad manners, not yours.  If your kids are greedy little buttheads, well, you did that so you fix it.  And if you just flat don't want to enjoy Christmas (bah, humbug) then....don't.  The cool thing about being an adult is that we don't have to do anything we don't want to do.


----------



## kwillia

vraiblonde said:


> It's never too late to have a happy childhood.
> 
> The general theme is that greed and commercialization have ruined Christmas.  It's become a gift competition instead of a time for friends, family, and festivity.  It's not Christmas itself that you hate, it's the humans involved in Christmas that suck.
> 
> But, as Bann said, you don't have to take part in that.  If you gift someone something modest and/or homemade and they snub it, that's on them and speaks to their bad manners, not yours.  If your kids are greedy little buttheads, well, you did that so you fix it.  And if you just flat don't want to enjoy Christmas (bah, humbug) then....don't.  The cool thing about being an adult is that we don't have to do anything we don't want to do.


Summed up nicely!  You can close this thread now!


----------



## lucky_bee

I get really disappointed when people make rude comments about my trees 

I'm an artsy person and I thoroughly enjoy planning and coordinating a beautiful tree. Something you'd see in Southern Living or in a window shop. I love it. It's fairly petty but it's kind of rude to tell me my tree and the time I spent decorating it was a waste bc you shouldn't "plan" your tree. It's not like I draw out diagrams :shrug: I just like having a theme and matching ribbon and coordinating ornaments. I feel like I'm allowed to do this now while I don't have kids. When they start bringing home some homemade ornaments, then my tree will start to resemble my parents' and I'll be perfectly fine with that. But there's always someone every year that looks at my pretty tree and tells me I'm ridiculous  

The first year I ever got to do my own tree, I got a lot of backlash from my ex's family bc mine wasn't "homey" enough  "It's gorgeous but all those ornaments came from target! you need some family ones and homemade ones to make this better!"  huh.

This year is the first time I've been able to have a tree in a couple years and it's all me: I have shoe ornaments, high-heeled black boots and some multi-colored peep toe pumps and I have several Barbie collectors ornaments and lots of bird-themed ornaments. All in coordinating colors with matching ribbon. I love it


----------



## vraiblonde

lucky_bee said:


> But there's always someone every year that looks at my pretty tree and tells me I'm ridiculous



I think you should punch them right in the throat.


----------



## lucky_bee

vraiblonde said:


> I think you should punch them right in the throat.


----------



## migtig

lucky_bee said:


> I get really disappointed when people make rude comments about my trees
> 
> I'm an artsy person and I thoroughly enjoy planning and coordinating a beautiful tree. Something you'd see in Southern Living or in a window shop. I love it. It's fairly petty but it's kind of rude to tell me my tree and the time I spent decorating it was a waste bc you shouldn't "plan" your tree. It's not like I draw out diagrams :shrug: I just like having a theme and matching ribbon and coordinating ornaments. I feel like I'm allowed to do this now while I don't have kids. When they start bringing home some homemade ornaments, then my tree will start to resemble my parents' and I'll be perfectly fine with that. But there's always someone every year that looks at my pretty tree and tells me I'm ridiculous
> 
> The first year I ever got to do my own tree, I got a lot of backlash from my ex's family bc mine wasn't "homey" enough  "It's gorgeous but all those ornaments came from target! you need some family ones and homemade ones to make this better!"  huh.
> 
> This year is the first time I've been able to have a tree in a couple years and it's all me: I have shoe ornaments, high-heeled black boots and some multi-colored peep toe pumps and I have several Barbie collectors ornaments and lots of bird-themed ornaments. All in coordinating colors with matching ribbon. I love it



I think I need to hire you.


----------



## lucky_bee

migtig said:


> I think I need to hire you.



I'd die. I'd love to just decorate things for a living. all year long. birthday parties, kids and adults, weddings, holidays. I did about 75% of the décor for my cousin's wedding in Annapolis. I had so much fun.


----------



## Misfit

migtig said:


> I always loved Christmas, always.  I grew up poor and I remember almost every single Christmas gift.  I'd get a present from Santa - something that I had been wanting and wishing for all year - one year it was a hula hoop - don't judge; a present from my Dad - some mix of socks, underwear, pjs, school clothes; a present from my grandmother - always something homemade - I still have one of the dolls she made me; a present from my grandfather (different side of my family) - always a Barbie Doll.  When my Mom was alive I'd get weird random things that were always fun at the time.  My Aunt continued that and I think my absolute favorite gift from her was a pink parasol.  I loved Christmas.  It was about hope, and new beginnings, and food, and friends, and all that.
> 
> As an adult, far from home, with no immediate family, I still loved Christmas.  I always put up a tree.  I always bought or made gifts that said I was thinking of you.  I always mailed Christmas cards.  I always had a blast, even if I spent Christmas alone with my dog.
> 
> Then I married my husband.    I fcking hate Christmas.  Christmas has become a soul sucking holiday.  I hate decorating.  I hate buying gifts.  I hate unappreciative jerk wads who want something expensive and can't be bothered to write a thank you note.  It's all about the biggest price tag.  Nobody likes "homemade" gifts" because they are "cheap".  (In no way is anything I make "cheap).  It's all about "me me me".  It's all about spending money on people who can't even be bothered to mail a Christmas card. They don't even cook!  Worst sin ever in my book.  Worst Christmas ever was spent with foul mouthed children with parents who refused to correct them, eating the nastiest cold congealed food I have ever had in my life.   I fcking hate Christmas.  My first Christmas with my husband, even he didn't appreciate my inexpensive thoughtful gifts.  They were shoved in a bag and I've never seen them again. My gifts from him were a bunch of "expensive" items I didn't want or need.  So every year, I buy him some gawdawful expensive price tag gift and hate myself for doing it.
> 
> I fcking hate Christmas.  It's not about what I thought it was about.
> 
> I'm with Roman, Jesus was born in the early summer and Christmas was all about co-opting a pagan holiday in order to get converts.



I couldn't  have said it better. This year we're  doing an anti-material Christmas. We can buy any present  that you can't  touch. I'm asking for an e-book, my son wants a video game download etc.


----------



## Larry Gude

Misfit said:


> I couldn't  have said it better. This year we're  doing an anti-material Christmas. We can buy any present  that you can't  touch. I'm asking for an e-book, my son wants a video game download etc.



Go do something y'all never do and make a new tradition that is just y'alls. Go hiking, regardless of weather. make something really unusual for dinner. Play board games. Something that is JUST y'alls. :shrug:


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## SamSpade

Well, I'm still at a stage in life where I love Christmas.

Mostly. My defining characteristic is anxiety. I worry. I worry about plans, gifts, food, guests and especially money.
Usually about a week before Christmas, it's all nailed down - presents are wrapped, plans are set, money is done.
The tree is up, decorations are up, and nothing is going to move until the New Year.

MOST times, work winds down so there's nothing to worry about (not so this year) so all is needed is a nice long peaceful
rest at home, all decorated with green and red. My little children in Christmas clothes giggling, playing and drinking cocoa
while Christmas music softly plays in the background.

The house smells of pine tree and apple cider. Yes, there's Christmas DINNER, which is work for everyone, but mostly
Christmas day and the few days that follow are easy, pleasant days. We watch typical Christmas fare, but generally
the TV is used less, largely because everything's on hiatus until the New Year, so we just relax.

We keep the gifts down - no more than three a child. My wife and I keep ours to each other at a bare minimum.
That's just money speaking - we just don't have it to splurge. It's enough we enjoy the day and our children are happy.

-----------------

That said, my favorite holiday is still Thanksgiving. It's just one day, it's mostly unspoiled by commercialism and there's
no "Thanksgiving season". It's just family, food and football.


----------



## b23hqb

Hate is way too strong a word to not like something. That word should be reserved for the extreme, like Bin Laden, terrorism, ISIS, Satan, pure evil. That is hate. If you don't like how something has turned out, changed, etc., just say it no longer appeals to you. That will suffice.

Save the hate for where it belongs - evil.


----------



## ProximaCentauri

b23hqb said:


> Hate is way too strong a word to not like something. That word should be reserved for the extreme, like Bin Laden, terrorism, ISIS, Satan, pure evil. That is hate. If you don't like how something has turned out, changed, etc., just say it no longer appeals to you. That will suffice.
> 
> Save the hate for where it belongs - evil.


'Evil' is in the eye of the beholder. Fundamentalist Muslims believe that YOU represent pure EVIL. They believe the Quran is the one TRUE word of the creator of the universe. You, the infidel, are the one who is under the control of Satan. You will burn in hell for all eternity. They have just as much claim to the "Truth" as you do since both religions are based on writings and faith that those writings are correct. Jesus could have been a charlatan and Muhammad the messenger of God. There is no way to know that or to prove that. That's why Muslims and Christians have slaughtered each other for a millennia and will continue to do so.


----------



## ProximaCentauri

So we have our tree up, looking forward to son coming home from college, cooking a feast, making eggnog, exchanging gifts, and sharing laughter and love with family and friends. Guess you might say I'm one Atheist that enjoys the hell out of Christmas!


----------



## Bann

lucky_bee said:


> I get really disappointed when people make rude comments about my trees
> 
> I'm an artsy person and I thoroughly enjoy planning and coordinating a beautiful tree. Something you'd see in Southern Living or in a window shop. I love it. It's fairly petty but it's kind of rude to tell me my tree and the time I spent decorating it was a waste bc you shouldn't "plan" your tree. It's not like I draw out diagrams :shrug: I just like having a theme and matching ribbon and coordinating ornaments. I feel like I'm allowed to do this now while I don't have kids. When they start bringing home some homemade ornaments, then my tree will start to resemble my parents' and I'll be perfectly fine with that. But there's always someone every year that looks at my pretty tree and tells me I'm ridiculous
> 
> The first year I ever got to do my own tree, I got a lot of backlash from my ex's family bc mine wasn't "homey" enough  "It's gorgeous but all those ornaments came from target! you need some family ones and homemade ones to make this better!"  huh.
> 
> This year is the first time I've been able to have a tree in a couple years and it's all me: I have shoe ornaments, high-heeled black boots and some multi-colored peep toe pumps and I have several Barbie collectors ornaments and lots of bird-themed ornaments. All in coordinating colors with matching ribbon. I love it



Phoooey on those idiots who are nasty about your tree.  WTH is wrong with people anyway?  I know someone who literally fills up every space in their house with a Christmas decoration figurine, floral arrangement, candle, yada yada.  They fill the yard with electric blow up decorations.  Their tree is up nearly right after the turkey leftovers are put away.  OK, that's not my cup of tea, but whatever.  :shrug: 

I like simple decorations, and a lot of them now are things people have given me or special ones I bought many years ago that I love to bring out.  This year, I didn't put a lot of things around the house, sometimes I do more, sometimes I do less.  The tree is really pretty this year, and I like the simplicity of it. Less to put away later!  

I always think I will decorate a tree with a theme some day.  So far I still put up my tree with all the traditional ornaments either given to me or the glass colored balls I bought and have used since I was in my 20's.  What the heck is wrong with planning out a tree?  I see nothing wrong with that.  Your shoe ornament tree sounds awesome - can you post a picture?


----------



## Bann

vraiblonde said:


> I think you should punch them right in the throat.


----------



## Bann

Larry Gude said:


> Go do something y'all never do and make a new tradition that is just y'alls. Go hiking, regardless of weather. make something really unusual for dinner. Play board games. Something that is JUST y'alls. :shrug:




  Good idea!


----------



## mamatutu

ProximaCentauri said:


> So we have our tree up, looking forward to son coming home from college, cooking a feast, making eggnog, exchanging gifts, and sharing laughter and love with family and friends. Guess you might say I'm one Atheist that enjoys the hell out of Christmas!



I have always liked your honesty on this forum.  I identify.  I just don't get why an atheist gets into Christmas.  But, that could be just me.  I did notice that another thread was started about a month ago, and people were slammed for not liking Christmas.  I love hypocrisy.    As for myself, I am not into Christmas now that my children are grown; we celebrate at their houses.  I don't decorate at my home anymore.  All I can think of at this point (current news is quite distressing) is the 'goodwill towards men' thing.  That seems to be lost as well.  I wish you happy holidays!


----------



## Larry Gude

ProximaCentauri said:


> 'Evil' is in the eye of the beholder. Fundamentalist Muslims believe that YOU represent pure EVIL. They believe the Quran is the one TRUE word of the creator of the universe. You, the infidel, are the one who is under the control of Satan. You will burn in hell for all eternity. They have just as much claim to the "Truth" as you do since both religions are based on writings and faith that those writings are correct. Jesus could have been a charlatan and Muhammad the messenger of God. There is no way to know that or to prove that. That's why Muslims and Christians have slaughtered each other for a millennia and will continue to do so.



Which is why my bible is the Constitution of the United States of America and why I am cool with Christianity and not Islam. Christianity has evolved and grown to respect the individual as paramount including the right to choose ones faith and it has done so in concert with the right to choose no faith. Islam is obedience. I respect the right to choose that and live ones life that way but, not any right to impose it on others. At least not IN the United States of America.


----------



## Larry Gude

Bann said:


> Good idea!






Someone wise once told me; "Life has no meaning. You give it meaning."


----------



## Monello

I have fond memories of Christmas growing up.  My dad sold Christmas trees and our house always smelled of pine.  The house was all decorated with a tree, boughs of pine adorned the mirror and shelve.  There were Christmas candles and stockings.  Times were lean as just my dad worked.  But my parents always went out of their way to make sure there were gifts.  Some times on a birthday all I got was a cake but Christmas always had special gifts under the tree.  My brother somehow managed to get up very early every year.  He'd wake me and we'd head to the living room to open presents.

Today I hate to see people running all over the place buying stuff and getting stressed out.  Better to make it about friends and family.  Maybe make a nice meal.  Sit down together and enjoy the season.  Maybe bake some cookies or other treats to give to people.  How many guys need another tie?  Better to make some memories, especially if you have young children, that will last a lifetime.


----------



## hotcoffee

Monello said:


> I have fond memories of Christmas growing up.  My dad sold Christmas trees and our house always smelled of pine.  The house was all decorated with a tree, boughs of pine adorned the mirror and shelve.  There were Christmas candles and stockings.  Times were lean as just my dad worked.  But my parents always went out of their way to make sure there were gifts.  Some times on a birthday all I got was a cake but Christmas always had special gifts under the tree.  My brother somehow managed to get up very early every year.  He'd wake me and we'd head to the living room to open presents.
> 
> Today I hate to see people running all over the place buying stuff and getting stressed out.  Better to make it about friends and family.  Maybe make a nice meal.  Sit down together and enjoy the season.  Maybe bake some cookies or other treats to give to people.  How many guys need another tie?  Better to make some memories, especially if you have young children, that will last a lifetime.





My dad was Navy.  We use to load up the green station wagon and make the trip from Gales Ferry, Conn to Front Royal, Va to my grandmother's house.  Sometimes there was snow and we would sled down the hill.  There was always a tree and great food.  Then we would leave there and go to Charlotte, NC to my dad's family.  There was always a party on Christmas Eve... we read the Nativity Story from the Bible and sang Christmas Carols, opened presents and then Santa would arrive during the night.... [Dad had stowed the presents under the pallet he made in the back of the station wagon].  There was always a great breakfast Christmas Morning.


----------



## acommondisaster

I'm actually pretty stoked about Christmas this year. I hauled the trees down from the attic last break and grudgingly started to decorate them; took me a couple of days because I had trouble finding some key components - my favorite garland, the tree skirts, the topper for the tree in the dining room, but they're finally done. Well, done as they're going to be, because I decided only to use about half the ornaments I usually use on the living room tree - since I'm the one who has to "undecorate" them afterwards.  

I'm working 12 hours Christmas eve and Christmas night, so we decided to delay Christmas until Saturday. My husband and I agreed no presents for each other; we'd rather save the money for work on the cabin.  Grandkids are not going to be here this Christmas and I've sent their presents off weeks ago and we set a pretty low limit for our daughter and our son and his wife. I'm having a good time putting together a gift basket for her that I know she'll love. 

The pressure's off. We're not using credit cards; there isn't going to be a ton to wrap or return and "Christmas dinner" will be a breeze, now that I know I get to cook it on my day off, rather than cringing and not being able to sleep between shifts on the 25th because I'm sure my husband's in the kitchen destroying a perfectly good prime rib and not doing the sides the way I'd do them. 

But the real clincher that made me decide this is a good Christmas came tonight as I backed out of the driveway to come to work - and you can think I'm silly if you want - I glanced at our house and realized my husband, all on his own, had turned on the Christmas tree lights.


----------



## mamatutu

I never hated Christmas.  I was just one that didn't expect presents or want to give presents when told to do so.  I like presents the other 364 days of the year.  You know, unexpected; like a surprise.  I put birthdays, anniversaries, Valentines Day, etc. into that category, as well.  Flowers on a random day, a present for no reason, a card just because you love someone that much.  I have always operated this way.  Christmas is Jesus' birthday.  Period.  Celebrate that and don't ever feel the pressure to give to anyone else on Dec. 25th.  Give throughout the year.  That is what Jesus would want.  Merry Christmas.


----------



## ProximaCentauri

mamatutu said:


> I have always liked your honesty on this forum.  I identify.  I just don't get why an atheist gets into Christmas.  But, that could be just me.  I did notice that another thread was started about a month ago, and people were slammed for not liking Christmas.  I love hypocrisy.    As for myself, I am not into Christmas now that my children are grown; we celebrate at their houses.  I don't decorate at my home anymore.  All I can think of at this point (current news is quite distressing) is the 'goodwill towards men' thing.  That seems to be lost as well.  I wish you happy holidays!



It's fine to use the term "Merry Christmas" with me instead of "Happy Holidays". Agree the 'goodwill towards men' thing is probably the most important part.
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to You and Yours!


----------



## acommondisaster

ProximaCentauri said:


> It's fine to use the term "Merry Christmas" with me instead of "Happy Holidays". Agree the 'goodwill towards men' thing is probably the most important part.
> Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to You and Yours!



Tolerance and understanding at its best. Would that everyone (me included) could understand the importance of other people's beliefs and let them be with their beliefs without malice or a desire to eradicate them.


----------



## hotcoffee

[video=youtube;fbnmvS-lRAk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbnmvS-lRAk[/video]


----------



## Pete

BadGirl said:


> I hate Christmas, too.  It wouldn't be hard for me to completely ignore it, but I have a son to think of, so despite what I feel about it, I feel like I have to do something for him.
> 
> I immensely dislike the music, the "Season's Greetings" messages, and I hate, hate, hate the presents - buying them, wrapping them, giving them, getting them, and paying for them.   To date, I haven't bought the first present, and I really hope that I don't break down and buy one - I didn't buy any last year, and it felt great to not have that stress on my shoulders.
> 
> I wish I could just fast-forward through the next two weeks.


I am with you.  I believe our society has outgrown the present giving part of Christmas. Back in the day when money was much tighter and people did not have nearly everything they desire you could go out and purchase something that they would not do for themselves.  It meant something.  Now it is virtually impossible to ascertain what someone would like because most people already have anything they could want and we end up racking our brains for ideas and then going with Hickory farms or Yankee candle.  

Take my BFF for instance.  Has everything in the world.  Needs or wants nothing.  Then I get a great idea only to find out her BF is getting her moose poop nuggets dipped in varnish and made into jewelry.  So now I am back to Hickory farms.


----------



## vraiblonde

Pete said:


> Take my BFF for instance.  Has everything in the world.  Needs or wants nothing.  Then I get a great idea only to find out her BF is getting her moose poop nuggets dipped in varnish and made into jewelry.  So now I am back to Hickory farms.



I do not think a girl can have too many moose poop necklaces.


----------



## Bann

Pete said:


> Take my BFF for instance.  Has everything in the world.  Needs or wants nothing.  Then I get a great idea only to find out her BF is getting her moose poop nuggets dipped in varnish and made into jewelry.  So now I am back to Hickory farms.





vraiblonde said:


> I do not think a girl can have too many moose poop necklaces.


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## Monello

vraiblonde said:


> I do not think a girl can have too many moose poop necklaces.



And how can we leave out the matching earrings.


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## hotcoffee

Here's a good reason to love Christmas!

[video=youtube;S0lymV0oH2U]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0lymV0oH2U[/video]


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## hotcoffee

How can anyone hate the season when a young child sings so angelic?

[video=youtube;pAe7EjJjaKY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAe7EjJjaKY[/video]


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## mamatutu

ProximaCentauri said:


> It's fine to use the term "Merry Christmas" with me instead of "Happy Holidays". Agree the 'goodwill towards men' thing is probably the most important part.
> Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to You and Yours!



Same to you, PC.  Let us hope that the New Year bodes better for mankind and the state of the world.

Merry Christmas!


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## hotcoffee

My family is enjoying the holidays!  My grandchildren are toddlers.... and this is how my daughter and son-in-law are opening the Christmas Holiday!

[video=youtube;7m3JS7sFzFg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7m3JS7sFzFg&feature=youtu.be[/video]


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## FollowTheMoney

I posted this in another thread hotcoffee, maybe you missed it?

Hot Coffee, Would you mind, if not too off putting, of describing how you came to know you had colon cancer? If you had any symptoms, and what they were and how they presented? How you came to be diagnosed? I think this information would be of great value to those who might not otherwise give colon cancer a second thought. And the importance of screening. You might help save a life.


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## hotcoffee

FollowTheMoney said:


> I posted this in another thread hotcoffee, maybe you missed it?
> 
> Hot Coffee, Would you mind, if not too off putting, of describing how you came to know you had colon cancer? If you had any symptoms, and what they were and how they presented? How you came to be diagnosed? I think this information would be of great value to those who might not otherwise give colon cancer a second thought. And the importance of screening. You might help save a life.



No problem at all...  I had a kidney stone which caused me to hit my max out of pocket for insurance.  So my PCP and I decided it was an excellent time for a woman my age to go through the regular diagnostic testing.  I had a mammogram, pap smear and a colonoscopy.  The colonoscopy showed I had a flat [as opposed to mushroom shaped] polyp.  It was removed and sent out for testing.  It came back as cancer.  

I was sent to George Washington University Hospital for surgery to undergo a right hemicolectomy.  The section of the colon that was removed was sent to the lab for testing.  It was classified stage IIIc.  The oncologist at George Washington University Hospital said that no chemo was recommended because the cure was worse than the cancer.  It appeared that although the tumor had entered the wall of the colon, it did not affect any of the 26 surrounding nodes.  

In all fairness.... the oncologist that my PCP had me follow up with here at Calvert Memorial... [rather than travel back and forth to DC] suggested chemotherapy but since an older [and more experienced I assumed due to his age and prestige] doctor had advised against it.... I did not opt for the suggestion of the younger local oncologist.

After you have colon cancer.... it's routine that you have regular CEA blood tests and an annual colonoscopy.  Before this testing was done.... I started to have some pain in the lower right part of my belly.  My PCP did a physical exam and found a lump in the area.  She ordered a CEA blood test and it came back higher than it should have.  I was then scheduled to go back to the oncologist.  He could not feel the lump that the PCP and I had found.  I was scheduled for a colonoscopy.  The colonoscopy showed more cancer of the same type in the area adjacent to the area where the resection had been done.  The oncologist sent me to Mercy Hospital to see another colon specialist.  He was as hairy as a bear... as I recall... he tried to get me to have a more sophisticated colonoscopy but dismissed the lump the PCP and I had felt.  The pain was persisting and  moving up in the abdomen by that time.  I opted not to go for the procedure he was selling because he dismissed the fact I was in pain.  He told me he felt is was a subcutaneous cyst.... nothing to worry about.  

At the end of August, the pain in my belly was becoming a daily issue.  That's when another kidney stone sent me back to Calvert Memorial Hospital.  The CT Scan I was given [so that they could locate the boulder my system was trying to pass] showed a subcutaneous mass 5cm X 3cmX 2.5cm at the belly button area [where the pain was now persistant].  I went though the kidney stone removal and then was scheduled for more tests.  The PET scan scheduled after the surgery showed a tumor that was now 6cm x 3cm x 2.5cm.  [for those of you who don't have a cm measure... it's about the size of a small human fist].  

_*Before the routine colonoscopy the only symptoms I had was occasional constipation.  There was no blood in my stool, no pain.... no real signs.  My family history has some colon cancer. *_ 

After a biopsy was performed I went back to my oncologist.  My diagnosis is now recurring metastatic colon cancer Stage 4.  It's terminal.  The doctor explained that without treatment I would have a couple of months.  With chemo and possibly surgery I could have as long as two years.  When considering the surgery I should consider whether or not the surgery could remove all the cancer.  Since there is a shadow on my stomach, a spot on my kidney, liver, and adrenal gland [along with the polyp in my colon that the doctor that did the colonoscopy could not reach during the colonoscopy], it isn't likely that the surgery I am scheduled to undergo will get it all.  

The pain at my belly button is so bad that I am now on a lot of pain killers.  I can't wear jeans anymore.  The pressure on the belly causes intense pain.  I have to wear non-restrictive clothing like dresses.  Now I cannot stand for more than 3-5 minutes before feeling acute pain in the belly.  I've gone through 5 rounds of chemo... [5-FU].  The tumor as only shrunk back to the size when it showed up on the CT Scan back in August.  

After my surgery on January 12th.... the plan is for hubby and I to meet with the oncologist to go over the pathology report.  I've used up 5 months of the 2 years.... we'll see what comes out of that meeting.

Thank you for asking.... the best way to avoid colon cancer is to have regular colon screenings.  If you have a history of colon cancer in your family.... talk to your primary care doctor.  Oh and the colonoscopy procedure has gotten a whole lot easier than it was just a few years ago.  Even the prep that you have to drink is better.....  

AND one last thing... if you cannot afford a colonoscopy.... talk to your PCP.... _there are programs that will pay for your procedure._ *Colon Cancer caught early can be cured. *


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## hotcoffee

All of us hate Christmas at least once or so in a lifetime.  

I've watched Christmases  come and go since the 50's.  

My kids left to see their dad one Christmas and it took me 15 years to get them back.  

This time of year... there are a lot of people who are lonely and sad..... commercialism when the economy sucks and so many of us are unemployed, underemployed, underwater, and the clerks all say "same to you" because it's politically correct.

We all have our trials and memories from our childhood.  Drugs, alcohol, abuse..... they seem to rise at Christmas.  Parents arguing about money is a real buzz kill.  

My daughter ran away from home one Christmas and came home pregnant.....  

There are a lot of dark times.... but if you have faith.....  it can all work out.  It takes time.... I've seen it happen in my own life.... over and over and over again.  

Have faith.... take some time to yourself and consider the Nativity Story as you first heard it.  Watch children.... it's a Birthday Party after all....  enjoy what you can.... I use to sing christmas carols to myself when I got down....  He's the reason I made it through those time....

It's ok to hate what Christmas has become....  as long as you remember just one memory of a holiday gone by..... I've had quite a few.... if you cherish just one memory... you have it to fall back on... that'll give you the courage to live in your faith when everyone around you is strapped in the pagan commercialism that surrounds the holidays....

Satan is really jealous about this time of year.... we are, after all, celebrating the beginning of the fulfillment of ancient prophecy..... Satan hates that with a passion... and he comes after those of us who choose to believe that Jesus is the Messiah.  It's a war of powers and principalities and even this war is a fulfillment of prophecy.... as a matter of Fact.... Jesus, Himself, told us it would happen.  Hang in there.... have faith... you can make it through this.... 

I'm dealing with colon cancer this holiday.... I refuse to let the cancer take away my faith in my Lord.... I plan to enjoy the holiday... it's the birthday of my Lord....


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## Dakota

Very positive attitude, hotcoffee, and that could very well be what has you beating the odds.  I've always been in the belief that we don't have a time stamp anywhere on our body.  My mother was diagnosed with cancer in her later 40's and given an excellent prognoses.  At the same time, my boss was diagnosed with cancer in his early 30's with a horrible prognoses, several years later they both died of terminal cancer (within a few days of each other).  My boss turned a 6 month prognoses into 4 years.  

I remember a story the funeral director in PA told me when I went back to bury my grandmother.  He told me his wife was diagnosed with colon cancer 7 years ago and given only 6 months to live.  The doctor told him and his wife to get their affairs in order when they gave her (and him) the prognoses.  A few days later, that doctor died in a car accident.  The funeral director looked at me and said "I wonder if anyone told him to get his affairs in order?"  It is just that nobody knows how long they have and your positive attitude will get you a very long way.  I do believe that.


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## hotcoffee

Dakota said:


> Very positive attitude, hotcoffee, and that could very well be what has you beating the odds.  I've always been in the belief that we don't have a time stamp anywhere on our body.  My mother was diagnosed with cancer in her later 40's and given an excellent prognoses.  At the same time, my boss was diagnosed with cancer in his early 30's with a horrible prognoses, several years later they both died of terminal cancer (within a few days of each other).  My boss turned a 6 month prognoses into 4 years.
> 
> I remember a story the funeral director in PA told me when I went back to bury my grandmother.  He told me his wife was diagnosed with colon cancer 7 years ago and given only 6 months to live.  The doctor told him and his wife to get their affairs in order when they gave her (and him) the prognoses.  A few days later, that doctor died in a car accident.  The funeral director looked at me and said "I wonder if anyone told him to get his affairs in order?"  It is just that nobody knows how long they have and your positive attitude will get you a very long way.  I do believe that.



It will be interesting to hear [read] the pathology report after the doctor actually looks inside and sees first hand what's going on.  

I have my biggest affair in order.  I know where I'm going on my next adventure.  

I'm working on getting my legal issues in order.  I'm also making sure that my most treasured earthly possessions are going to the right family members.  I'm sending them with a note inside.  It helps to write a note with a memory in it.  I sent some old encyclopedia year books to my cousin.  They were given to me by her grandmother after her mother died.  It meant a lot to her.... it meant a lot to me to know she had something in her hands that her mother had once enjoyed.  I have a few more "special" items to send.  I'll get them in the mail after the holidays.  I got to think about my aunt and my cousin... and the memories we shared.  They're waiting for me when I start my new adventure, whenever that may be.


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## FollowTheMoney

hotcoffee said:


> Before the routine colonoscopy the only symptoms I had was occasional constipation. There was no blood in my stool, no pain.... no real signs. My family history has some colon cancer.


I always thought colon cancer had noticeable symptoms. I've been educated. Thank you.


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