# Racism



## This_person

There are too many WHITE MALES in government - Susan Rice


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## Monello

Well if POCs didn't vote for them....


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## Larry Gude

Link? Would be better to have it.


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## Wishbone

This_person said:


> There are too many WHITE MALES in government - Susan Rice



Not where I'm at.


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## This_person

Larry Gude said:


> Link? Would be better to have it.



If you'd like the actual quote:


			
				Susan Rice said:
			
		

> I’m privileged to work with brilliant and dedicated professionals across our government.  But we must acknowledge that our national security agencies have not yet drawn fully on the strengths of our great nation.  Minorities still make up less than 20 percent of our senior diplomats.  Less than 15 percent of senior military officers and senior intelligence officials.  Too often, our national security workforce has been what former Florida Senator Bob Graham called “white, male, and Yale.”  In the halls of power, in the faces of our national security leaders, America is still not fully reflected.


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## Larry Gude

That's a bit different than white/male. Adding in Yale adds a lot of other white guys. I accuse you of SHW, selective headline writing!


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## black dog

Wishbone said:


> Not where I'm at.



 Yep,,, the last time I was in the Social Security Office in Camp Springs other than the rent a cop I was the only other white guy in the building, and that includes the Government workers.


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## Monello

black dog said:


> Yep,,, the last time I was in the Social Security Office in Camp Springs other than the rent a cop I was the only other white guy in the building, and that includes the Government workers.



DC VA hosp looks to be about 80% non white staff.  Like Rice-a-roni said, not fully reflective of America.


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## black dog

Monello said:


> DC VA hosp looks to be about 80% non white staff.  Like Rice-a-roni said, not fully reflective of America.



 The Marion, Indiana VA hospital is just the opposite. Up till 2 years ago I would take one of my great uncles to the VA in Memphis a few times a year, it was like DC if not more. I will add that it is a very nice hospital and he received excellent service there. 
 If we went to see two doctors with appointments, they would work us in to see other doctors for issues that would come up while we were there. Such as new glasses, hearing aids, battery's, a heart check with new medication, short arm   and so on.


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## This_person

Larry Gude said:


> That's a bit different than white/male. Adding in Yale adds a lot of other white guys. I accuse you of SHW, selective headline writing!



Kinda think "white, male, and Yale" stands on its own, but "America is not fully reflected" sort of adds to it, too.


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## Larry Gude

This_person said:


> Kinda think "white, male, and Yale" stands on its own, but "America is not fully reflected" sort of adds to it, too.



No. White, male and Yale, she had a point and it's not to say 'white, male and UC Santa Barbara'   I' no fan of Rice's but this sort of thing shouldn't be a big deal. YOU and ME, we all, suffer from the myopia that IS white AND make AND Yale.


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## Gilligan

Larry Gude said:


> YOU and ME, we all, suffer from the myopia that IS white AND make AND Yale.



Not me.


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## This_person

Larry Gude said:


> No. White, male and Yale, she had a point and it's not to say 'white, male and UC Santa Barbara'   I' no fan of Rice's but this sort of thing shouldn't be a big deal. YOU and ME, we all, suffer from the myopia that IS white AND make AND Yale.



No, sir, I do not think I do.  I work with and for white, black, yellow, and red.  Male and female.  To suggest that the proportion "should" be something is myopic.  There are very few male nurses (not none, very few) compared with the proportion of males in the general population.  There are very few female dock workers.  That's ok.  Male nurses would not add to the field any more than female dock workers if they are not inclined, interested, and physically and emotionally suited for the positions.  Do you think there is even a bit of difference in thought-process between Chelsea Clinton and Sasha Obama, outside of age?  How about Sasha and Jakeita Days?  Jakeita Days and Kat Von D?  I think Chelsea and Sasha would have no idea who Jakeita and Kat are, but Jakeita and Kat probably have a lot more in common that Kat and Chelsea.

This is all true for men, too.  I don't give one flying #### what someone's color is, or even (most of the time) sex.  I think they need to have the right thought processes, and I DO think there is value in diversity of thought.  You're not going to get that if you have Chelsea and Sasha, but you will with Chelsea and Kat, or Jakeita and Sasha.  Color is meaningless.


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## Wishbone

Artificial.

Join the Penitentes.


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## Larry Gude

Gilligan said:


> Not me.



It doesn't bother you, of all people, that folks from the same backgrounds keep ending up in the same positions of power? Does it bother you that Sec Treas is what you do after working for Goldman, that's it's basically a retirement gift from the company, to itself?


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## Larry Gude

This_person said:


> No, sir, I do not think I do.  I work with and for white, black, yellow, and red.  Male and female.  To suggest that the proportion "should" be something is myopic.  .



No it's not. It's biology. Biodiversity is a good and healthy thing. I'm not advocating for someone simply based on their gender or skin color but I am saying that if you keep harvesting the same crop from the same field with the same practices, the yield declines, inexorably, until the yield is bad.


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## Wishbone

Larry Gude said:


> No it's not. It's biology. Biodiversity is a good and healthy thing. I'm not advocating for someone simply based on their gender or skin color ...



Actually it reads like you ARE saying just that. 

If it doesn't look right, we need to colorize.


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## Larry Gude

Wishbone said:


> Actually it reads like you ARE saying just that.
> 
> If it doesn't look right, we need to colorize.



This is pretty simple. Do you think it serves US national interests if the same type of people with the same backgrounds and same schooling, same SCHOOL, are in charge of policy, year after year after year?


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## Wishbone

Larry Gude said:


> This is pretty simple. Do you think it serves US national interests if the same type of people with the same backgrounds and same schooling, same SCHOOL, are in charge of policy, year after year after year?



Probably not, but ethnicity is not a valid criteria.


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## This_person

Larry Gude said:


> No it's not. It's biology. Biodiversity is a good and healthy thing. I'm not advocating for someone simply based on their gender or skin color but I am saying that if you keep harvesting the same crop from the same field with the same practices, the yield declines, inexorably, until the yield is bad.



Then we're saying the same thing - which is very different from what Rice said.  Rice was concerned with race and gender (white, male), and you and I are concerned with diversity of thought.


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## Larry Gude

Wishbone said:


> Probably not, but ethnicity is not a valid criteria.



Why not? You don't think a black kid or a an Hispanic kid or a woman, who earns their way into a shot into the National Security apparatus brings anything to do the job that yet another white kid from yet another rich family with yet another leg up from Yale brings to the table?


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## Wishbone

Larry Gude said:


> Why not? You don't think a black kid or a an Hispanic kid or a woman, who earns their way into a shot into the National Security apparatus brings anything to do the job that yet another white kid from yet another rich family with yet another leg up from Yale brings to the table?



Whether they do or not should have NOTHING to do with their melanin level or ancestral background.


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## This_person

Larry Gude said:


> Why not? You don't think a black kid or a an Hispanic kid or a woman, who earns their way into a shot into the National Security apparatus brings anything to do the job that yet another white kid from yet another rich family with yet another leg up from Yale brings to the table?



I think a black kid from a rich family who went to Yale is likely to have the same thought process as the same white kid.  The poor white kid who had to work his/her way up, earning every step, is likely to have the same thought process as the black kid who did the same.

Diversity of thought, not color.


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## Larry Gude

This_person said:


> I think a black kid from a rich family who went to Yale is likely to have the same thought process as the same white kid.  The poor white kid who had to work his/her way up, earning every step, is likely to have the same thought process as the black kid who did the same.
> 
> Diversity of thought, not color.



So, that's a round about way of agreeing with her point.


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## This_person

Larry Gude said:


> So, that's a round about way of agreeing with her point.



It MAY be agreeing with "Yale", but certainly not with "white" or "male".  One out of three is a failing grade.


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## Larry Gude

This_person said:


> I think a black kid from a rich family who went to Yale is likely to have the same thought process as the same white kid.  The poor white kid who had to work his/her way up, earning every step, is likely to have the same thought process as the black kid who did the same.
> 
> Diversity of thought, not color.



So, that's a round about way of agreeing with her point.


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## Wishbone

Do all these intellectual contortions cause you pain?


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## Larry Gude

Wishbone said:


> Do all these intellectual contortions cause you pain?



Not at all. You? 

Diversity is a natural benefit be it bio diversity, thought or back ground. Simple stuff.


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## Wishbone

I'm not the one doing somersaults to agree with Susan Rice.

She is profoundly clear in that she thinks having minority fill is more important that having qualifications.


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## Larry Gude

Wishbone said:


> I'm not the one doing somersaults to agree with Susan Rice.
> 
> She is profoundly clear in that she thinks having minority fill is more important that having qualifications.



She names three variables. That simple math is tripping you up isn't my problem.


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## Wishbone

Larry Gude said:


> She names three variables. That simple math is tripping you up isn't my problem.



Not tripped up at all.... I see nothing wrong with white or male.  

If she said that the overwhelmingly vapid perspectives of the college educated twits that those institutions produce these days was a problem, and we should be looking to more educationally or vocationally diverse backgrounds... I can completely agree with that statement. 

That's not what she said, and it's not what she's pushing.


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## Larry Gude

Wishbone said:


> Not tripped up at all.... I see nothing wrong with white or male.   .



Me neither. Her neither. What she said, that TP so politely posted, was this; 



> Originally Posted by Susan Rice, FIU 2016 Commencement
> I’m privileged to work with brilliant and dedicated professionals across our government. But we must acknowledge that our national security agencies have not yet drawn fully on the strengths of our great nation. Minorities still make up less than 20 percent of our senior diplomats. Less than 15 percent of senior military officers and senior intelligence officials. Too often, our national security workforce has been what former Florida Senator Bob Graham called “white, male, and Yale.” In the halls of power, in the faces of our national security leaders, America is still not fully reflected.



Now, I'm just a humble product of public schools but 'white, male and yale' is 3 variables.


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## Larry Gude

Wishbone said:


> That's not what she said, and it's not what she's pushing.



Ok, so, can you not read TP's post of her actual quote? Does it not show up on your monitor? Maybe there is some sort of technical problem where you can't see or read what TP shared with the class?


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## GURPS

Wishbone said:


> If she said that the overwhelmingly vapid perspectives of the college educated twits that those institutions produce these days was a problem, and we should be looking to more educationally or vocationally diverse backgrounds... I can completely agree with that statement.








> That's not what she said, and it's not what she's pushing.





I had no problem seeing white males [Yale Educated] were the problem ..... otherwise why would a person of color [female at that] mention the white part


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## This_person

Larry Gude said:


> 'white, male and yale' is 3 variables.



Yes, and of those three variables, one makes sense and two do not.


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## Wishbone

This is Larry being Larry. 

I'm done.


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## Larry Gude

This_person said:


> Yes, and of those three variables, one makes sense and two do not.



Right but she did NOT say 'white males' as Wishbone is stuck on. She said, and was merely repeating what white Harvard boy Bob Graham was saying; WHITE MALE YALE


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## Larry Gude

Wishbone said:


> This is Larry being Larry.
> 
> I'm done.



Given I'm arguing the plain facts and you're arguing your incomplete opinion, I'll take the W.


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## This_person

Larry Gude said:


> Right but she did NOT say 'white males' as Wishbone is stuck on. She said, and was merely repeating what white Harvard boy Bob Graham was saying; WHITE MALE YALE



Ah, but she did say white, male, and Yale.  Three variables.  Two of those three are White and Male.  The only reason those would have been included in the list is to suggest a problem with all three, not just one of the three.  Not just two of the three.  No, the problem was with all three combined.

If the problem wasn't white, as in there was a plethora of colors, but they were all male and from Yale, she would have just said "male and Yale".  But, she didn't.  There's no way to see that but that she has a problem with them being white, being male, and being from Yale.  All three variables are each an individual issue for her.


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## Wishbone

Larry Gude said:


> Given I'm arguing the plain facts and you're arguing your incomplete opinion, I'll take the W.



Larry, stop drinking the Flint tap water and seek treatment. 

You were more sensible, succinct and sane in years past.


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## Wishbone

This_person said:


> Ah, but she did say white, male, and Yale.  Three variables.  Two of those three are White and Male.  The only reason those would have been included in the list is to suggest a problem with all three, not just one of the three.  Not just two of the three.  No, the problem was with all three combined.
> 
> If the problem wasn't white, as in there was a plethora of colors, but they were all male and from Yale, she would have just said "male and Yale".  But, she didn't.  There's no way to see that but that she has a problem with them being white, being male, and being from Yale.  All three variables are each an individual issue for her.



Good Luck.


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