# Matthew 12:40



## rstrats

Whenever the three days and three nights of Matthew 12:40 is brought up in a “discussion” with 6th day crucifixion folks, they frequently argue that it is a common Jewish idiom for counting any part of a day as a whole day.  I wonder if anyone (who thinks that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week and who thinks that the "heart of the earth" means the tomb) knows of any writing that shows that a phrase stating a specific number of days as well as a specific number of nights was ever used in the first century or before when it absolutely couldn't have included at least parts of each one of the specific number of days and at least parts of each one of the specific number of nights?


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## b23hqb

rstrats said:


> Whenever the three days and three nights of Matthew 12:40 is brought up in a “discussion” with 6th day crucifixion folks, they frequently argue that it is a common Jewish idiom for counting any part of a day as a whole day.  I wonder if anyone (who thinks that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week and who thinks that the "heart of the earth" means the tomb) knows of any writing that shows that a phrase stating a specific number of days as well as a specific number of nights was ever used in the first century or before when it absolutely couldn't have included at least parts of each one of the specific number of days and at least parts of each one of the specific number of nights?



There are grounds for debate, even in my assembly of Brethren, of a Thursday or Friday execution of our Lord and Savior. "Three days and three nights" does not necessarily require 72 hours need to elapse between the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus, due to the Jewish reckoning that any part of a day is a whole day.

The verse also says Jonah was in the belly of the fish or whale for three days and nights. The connection between the two requires an historical Jonah who was actually swallowed by a very big fish.

Seeing that I believe the Bible to be the inerrant Word of God, and even though it is difficult to go against nearly 2,000 years of tradition of a Good Friday, I tend to lean for a Thursday crucifixion, but it really doesn't matter. It is not an eternal issue that affects personal salvation through belief in the execution, burial, and resurrection of Jesus, why it happened, and for the purpose of it happening.


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## rstrats

b23hqb,

re:  "Three days and three nights" does not necessarily require 72 hours..."

But it does require at least parts of three days and at least parts of three nights.  That is unless there are examples from the first century or before that show that that absolutey, no doubt about it, couldn't have been the case.   


re:  "..., due to the Jewish reckoning that any part of a day is a whole day"

As regards the Jewish practice of counting any part of a calendar day as a whole calendar day I would agree, but when "nights" is added to "days" to yield the phrase "X days AND X nights" it normally refers to a measurement of a time period where "day" refers to the light portion of a 24 hour period and "night"refers to the dark portion of a 24 hour period. No one In the history of apologetics as far as I know has ever presented any historical documentation that the phrase X days AND X nights was a unique first century idiom of Hebrew/Aramaic/Greek which could mean something different than what the phrase means in English.. If you have such documentation, I would very much like to see it.  That is what the OP is requesting.  



re:   "It is not an eternal issue that affects personal salvation..."

It might.  When asked by the scribes and Pharisees for a sign of his authority, the Messiah said that the only sign would be His entombment for three days AND three nights. If He didn't spend that time in the tomb, then He would not qualify.


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## Zguy28

Here is a good article (IMHO) dealing with this.

On what day was Jesus crucified?

I think the conclusion is spot on:



> In the grand scheme of things, it is not all that important to know what day of the week Christ was crucified. If it were very important, then God's Word would have clearly communicated the day and timeframe. What is important is that He did die and that He physically, bodily rose from the dead. What is equally important is the reason He died—to take the punishment that all sinners deserve. John 3:16 and 3:36 both proclaim that putting your trust in Him results in eternal life! This is equally true whether He was crucified on a Wednesday, Thursday, or Friday.


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## rstrats

Zguy28,

re:  " What is equally important is the reason He died—to take the punishment that all sinners deserve."

Although completely off topic, I just have to ask - what punishment did the Messiah take that would otherwise have to be taken by sinners?


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## Zguy28

rstrats said:


> Zguy28,
> 
> re:  " What is equally important is the reason He died—to take the punishment that all sinners deserve."
> 
> Although completely off topic, I just have to ask - what punishment did the Messiah take that would otherwise have to be taken by sinners?



John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.

So, somehow, by believing in what Jesus did in order to be saved, we are reconciled to God and Justified (a legal term in the Greek) and His wrath is removed from us. 

But how? Did it just magically get removed? That wouldn't be very just on God's part to just let sinners off the hook.

God's justice had to be satisfied.

Galatians 3:13
13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree”

On the cross Jesus experienced way more than physical suffering. In some incomprehensible way to us, He was somehow separated from fellowship with the Father and suffered God's wrath or curse, something all people deserve, because we all sin.

Romans 6:36
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Its free because somebody else paid for it.

Why do you think He was so distraught in the garden, knowing what was coming? It wasn't the physical pain He was anxious about.


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## rstrats

Someone new looking in my know of some writing.


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## b23hqb

I'll stick with my post in #2, and the quote by Zguy in post #4 echos that as well. 

The day of the week is not an eternal issue, IMHO. There is certainly room for discussion on that topic, though.

I'm just glad Jesus died for my sins, and because of that, I and millions of others, simply following the pattern scripture laid out for salvation, have been saved through His work on the cross, His burial, and His resurrection.


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## rstrats

b23hgb,

re:  "I'll stick with my post in #2..."


Since you say that you lean toward a 5th day of the week crucifixion, you don't have a problem with the 3 nights of Matthew 12:40.  It's the 6th day of the week crucifixion adherents that have a problem with having to get around the 3 days and 3 nights.  Many of them try to do that by saying that the verse is using commom Jewish idiomatic language.  I am simply asking them for an actual example of such usage which shows that a phrase stating a specific number of days as well as a specific number of nights was ever used in the first century or before when it absolutely couldn't have included at least parts of each one of the specific number of days and at least parts of each one of the specific number of nights.


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## b23hqb

I lean toward a Thursday, but I'm not completely dogmatic on it, simply because there are arguments scripturally for a Wednesday execution, as well as the Jewish reckoning of days and nights for a Friday execution. I'm just more convinced with the symbolism of Jonah in the belly of the fish representing Jesus as the three days and nights between the crucifixion and resurrection.


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## b23hqb

rstrats - here is a good link that really gets down to it for the possible days. I use CARM a lot, right now for the first time on this topic, along with a number of other really good Bible sites:

On what day was Jesus crucified and buried on? - Page 8

It is a really good piece of work, and only takes a few minutes to read.

This last paragraph says it all about the importance of whatever day it was:

"In the grand scheme of things, it is not all that important to know what day of the week Christ was crucified. If it were very important, then God's Word would have clearly communicated the day and timeframe. What is important is that He did die and that He physically, bodily rose from the dead. What is equally important is the reason He died—to take the punishment that all sinners deserve. John 3:16 and 3:36 both proclaim that putting your trust in Him results in eternal life! This is equally true whether He was crucified on a Wednesday, Thursday, or Friday."


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## rstrats

b23hqb,

re:  "...here is a good link that really gets down to it for the possible days."


I started this topic not with the intent of hashing over the day of the crucifixion but rather with the intent of seeing if any of the writing requested in the OP exists.  So far none has been provided.


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## rstrats

Someone new looking in who thinks that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week may know of some writing.


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## rstrats

Perhaps a further rewording of the OP will make it a bit more clear:   Whenever the three days and three nights of Matthew 12:40 is brought up in a "discussion" with 6th day of the week crucifixion folks, they frequently assert that it is using common Jewish idiomatic language.  I wonder if anyone knows of any writing that shows an example from the first century or before regarding a period of time that is said to consist of a specific number of days and/or a specific number of nights where the period of time absolutely couldn't have included at least a part of each one of the specific number of days and at least a part of each one of the specific number of nights?  If it is using common idiomatic language, there ought to be examples of that usage in order to be able to make that assertion.


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## PsyOps

rstrats said:


> Someone new looking in who thinks that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week may know of some writing.



If I said I thought it was on the 5th day, am I no longer saved?


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## rstrats

PsyOps,
re:  "If I said I thought it was on the 5th day, am I no longer saved?"

What makes you think that it might be a salvation issue?


And even if it were an issue, why would thinking that the crucifixion took place on the most likely day of the week, i.e. the 5th day, cause a loss of salvation?


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## b23hqb

rstrats said:


> PsyOps,
> re:  "If I said I thought it was on the 5th day, am I no longer saved?"
> 
> What makes you think that it might be a salvation issue?



I think PsyOps is saying what you just said, and what I believe: It is not an issue concerning salvation and eternity. God left a number of mysteries open in the Bible, and I think He gets a kick out of seeing us thinking and talking about those mysteries, which, in reality, we are talking about Him. Talking about Him is always good.


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## Dondi

Perhaps an explanation from a Rabbi might clear things up. He tends to believe that Christ was crucified on Wednesday and that the three days/nights is NOT an idiom:

http://tzion.org/articles/threedays.html

I think he makes some interesting points, especially about the Passover Lamb preparation.


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## b23hqb

Dondi said:


> Perhaps an explanation from a Rabbi might clear things up. He tends to believe that Christ was crucified on Wednesday and that the three days/nights is NOT an idiom:
> 
> http://tzion.org/articles/threedays.html
> 
> I think he makes some interesting points, especially about the Passover Lamb preparation.



I sort of lean that way because there were two Passovers that week. Either Wednesday or Thursday seems to make more sense chronologically than Friday, but this Christian will not be dogmatic on this topic.

BTW, I have read that exact same commentary before, explained in the Jewish reckoning.


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## hotcoffee

you probably answered this before in this thread.... but what day of he week was the Passover lamb slaughtered?


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## Dondi

hotcoffee said:


> you probably answered this before in this thread.... but what day of he week was the Passover lamb slaughtered?





Hmmmm....No, I haven't heard it before. Could you enlighten me, please?


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## b23hqb

hotcoffee said:


> you probably answered this before in this thread.... but what day of he week was the Passover lamb slaughtered?



Check this link out and you'll be more confused than ever.

http://www.centuryone.com/crucifixion.html

Tons of good info on this topic, which is why I will not be dogmatic on the exact day of the crucifixion.

Maybe you're thinking of the paschal lamb that I believe could also be the passover lamb. 

I'm not scholarly enough to bet my life on any date.


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## PsyOps

b23hqb said:


> I think PsyOps is saying what you just said, and what I believe: It is not an issue concerning salvation and eternity. God left a number of mysteries open in the Bible, and I think He gets a kick out of seeing us thinking and talking about those mysteries, which, in reality, we are talking about Him. Talking about Him is always good.



Sometimes wonder what the underlying motive is for bringing up these discussions; quibbling over non-issues.  We've seen so many of these benign discussions turn into a 'if you're not doing this or believing that you're not saved'.


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## rstrats

THE_GOVERNOR,

Since you are not a 6th day of the week crucifixion advocate, you probably won't know of any writing. But perhaps someone new looking in will know of some.


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## Gilligan

Dang Govvy..I keep trying your number but I get the "900 message" about what it's about to cost me, per minute and, ...well..I have to hang up because it's out of my price range. Sorry sweetie.


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## PsyOps

THE_GOVERNOR said:


> *
> That's because  --- YOU --- Can't READ
> That's No Consequence to us...
> 
> *



'Us"?


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## rstrats

Dondi,
re:  "Perhaps an explanation from a Rabbi might clear things up. He tends to believe that Christ was crucified on Wednesday and that the three days/nights is NOT an idiom:"

But the OP is requesting writing that proves that it IS an idiom - specifically that it is a common idiom.


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## rstrats

Since it's been awhile, perhaps someone new looking in will know of examples.


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## rstrats

Well into the new year, maybe someone new looking in will know of examples as requested in the OP and clarified in further posts. And again, remember that the purpose of this topic is not to discuss how long the Messiah was in the heart of the earth. As stated, there are other topics that do that. However, there are some who say that Matthew 12:40 is using common Jewish idiomatic/figure of speech/colloquial  language to try to explain the missing 3rd night, which would have to be the case with a 6th day of the week crucifixion/1st day of the week resurrection. But in order to legitimately say that it was employing common, idiomatic/figure of speech/colloquial language, one would have to know of other instances where a daytime or a night time was predicted to be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could occur.  I am simply looking for some of those instances, scriptural or otherwise.


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## rstrats

Maybe a rewording will make it a bit more clear.

1. The Messiah said that He would be three days and three nights in the "heart of the earth"  

2. There are those who think that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week with the resurrection taking place on the 1st day of the week.

3. Of those, there are some who think that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb.

4. A 6th day of the week crucifixion/1st day of the week resurrection allows for only 2 nights to be involved. 

5. To account for the lack of a 3rd night, some of those  mentioned above say that the Messiah was employing common figure of speech/colloquial language. 

6. I am simply asking anyone who thinks it was common,  to provide examples to support that belief; i.e., instances where a daytime or a night time was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of the daytime and/or no part of the night time could have occurred.


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## seekeroftruth

I don't see the issue here.... Back in the day.... using the correct dialect.... three days and three nights would work if it were only part of the third.... things were different then....

Take for instance all the arguments Jesus had with the Pharisees.... the Pharisees were protecting what they had always been taught.... God was going to send a warrior... a king.... and Jesus didn't fit their criteria.... they were doing the right thing... but it was wrong.... they couldn't see it as clearly as we can today...


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## rstrats

seekeroftruth,
re:  "I don't see the issue here.... Back in the day.... using the correct dialect.... three days and three nights would work if it were only part of the third.... "

How do you know that?  Do you have examples that show that it was common to say that a daytime or a night time would be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could have occurred?


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## seekeroftruth

It's called faith.... if the Bible says it's true.... then it is.... it's called faith....

Put your "now we got 'em" verse in context.  Jesus was talking to the Pharisees.  The Pharisees wanted to see some kind of sign.  If Jesus did a miracle, they would accuse Him of using magic.  If He didn't perform for them, they would call him a fake.  So Jesus opted to use it as a teaching moment.

*Matthew 12:38 Then some of the Pharisees and teachers of the law said to him, “Teacher, we want to see a sign from you.”

39 He answered, “A wicked and adulterous generation asks for a sign! But none will be given it except the sign of the prophet Jonah. 40 For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. 41 The men of Nineveh will stand up at the judgment with this generation and condemn it; for they repented at the preaching of Jonah, and now something greater than Jonah is here. 42 The Queen of the South will rise at the judgment with this generation and condemn it; for she came from the ends of the earth to listen to Solomon’s wisdom, and now something greater than Solomon is here.

43 “When an impure spirit comes out of a person, it goes through arid places seeking rest and does not find it. 44 Then it says, ‘I will return to the house I left.’ When it arrives, it finds the house unoccupied, swept clean and put in order. 45 Then it goes and takes with it seven other spirits more wicked than itself, and they go in and live there. And the final condition of that person is worse than the first. That is how it will be with this wicked generation.​*”

Here's what I found on these verses at blueletterbible.org.

Teacher, we want to see a sign from You:* Their desire to see a sign really expressed another way in which they hoped to reject Him.* If Jesus did provide a sign, they would find some way to speak against it, thus proving to themselves that Jesus was who they already thought He was - an emissary of Satan (Matthew 12:24).

i. "The apparent respect and earnestness of the request are feigned: 'teacher, we desire from you (emphatic position) to see a sign'. It reminds one of the mock homage of the soldiers at the Passion (Matthew 27:27-31)." (Bruce)

ii. "Had not Christ shown them signs enough? What were all the miracles he had wrought in their sight? They either speak this out of a further idle curiosity … or else they speak it in direct opposition." (Poole)​
b. An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign:* Jesus condemned their seeking after a sign*, especially when countless signs had already happened before their eyes. It is easy to overestimate the power of miraculous signs to change the heart of doubters and skeptics.

c. The sign of the prophet Jonah: Jesus assured them of a sign, but the great sign He would show was the sign of a resurrected Jesus. Jonah was a prophet in the sense beyond his preaching to Nineveh; also, his life was a prophecy of the death and resurrection of Jesus.

d. As Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish: Jonah was indeed a picture of the work of Jesus. Jonah gave his life to appease the wrath of God coming upon others. But death did not hold him; after three days and nights of imprisonment, he was alive and free. This is a glorious picture of Jesus in an unexpected place.

i.* Because Jesus here refers to three days and three nights, some think that Jesus had to spend at least 72 hours in the grave.* This upsets most chronologies of the death and resurrection of Jesus, and is unnecessary - because it doesn't take into account the use of ancient figures of speech. Rabbi Eleazar ben Azariah (around the year A.D. 100; cited in Clarke and other sources) explained this way of speaking when he wrote: *"A day and a night make a whole day, and a portion of a whole day is reckoned as a whole day." This demonstrates how in Jesus' day, the phrase three days and three nights did not necessarily mean a full 72-hour period, but a period including at least the portions of three days and three nights.* There may be other good reasons for challenging the traditional chronology of Jesus' death and resurrection, but it is not necessary in order to fulfill the words of Jesus here.

ii. *If Jesus rose from the dead on the first day or on the fifth day, we could say "Jesus was a liar and a false prophet. He said He would rise again on the third day, but He got it wrong." But Jesus didn't get it wrong. He never does.*

iii. Yet we should not miss the central point here. *"You are asking for a sign - I am God's sign. You have failed to recognize me.* The Ninevites recognized God's warning in Jonah; the Queen of Sheba recognized God's wisdom in Solomon." (Barclay)​
Here's a link to an article on the subject.... hope it helps.... "Three Days and Three Nights"......

Please use your faith and put these "now we got 'em" rantings away.


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## rstrats

seekerof truth,
re:  "It's called faith.... if the Bible says it's true.... then it is.... it's called faith...."

Where does the Bible say that it was common to forecast that a daytime or a night time would be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could occur?


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## seekeroftruth

rstrats said:


> seekerof truth,
> re:  "It's called faith.... if the Bible says it's true.... then it is.... it's called faith...."
> 
> Where does the Bible say that it was common to forecast that a daytime or a night time would be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could occur?



So that Pharisees would continue to test the faith of followers?

If someone will feed you, heal you, and give you hope.... why would you question them about the hour of the day unless you are trying to test your own faith?

*They didn't have clocks..... they didn't punch time clocks or set alarms....* so doesn't it make sense that when they said midnight they would be talking about the about the middle of the period between dusk and dawn.... wouldn't noon be more like midday when the sun was "about" the middle of the sky?  



God controls time.... He can make the earth stand still.  

Look at the time Lazarus was in the grave..... At four days... he was stinky.....  

*John 11:38 Jesus, once more deeply moved, came to the tomb. It was a cave with a stone laid across the entrance. 39 “Take away the stone,” he said.

“But, Lord,” said Martha, the sister of the dead man, “by this time there is a bad odor, for he has been there four days.”

40 Then Jesus said, “Did I not tell you that if you believe, you will see the glory of God?”

41 So they took away the stone. Then Jesus looked up and said, “Father, I thank you that you have heard me. 42 I knew that you always hear me, but I said this for the benefit of the people standing here, that they may believe that you sent me.”

43 When he had said this, Jesus called in a loud voice, “Lazarus, come out!” 44 The dead man came out, his hands and feet wrapped with strips of linen, and a cloth around his face.

Jesus said to them, “Take off the grave clothes and let him go.”*​


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## rstrats

seekeroftruth,
re:  "So that Pharisees would continue to test the faith of followers?"

What's the question that causes your question?




re:  "If someone will feed you, heal you, and give you hope.... why would you question them about the hour of the day..."

That's an issue for a different topic. 



re:  "...so doesn't it make sense that when they said midnight they would be talking about the about the middle of the period between dusk and dawn.... wouldn't noon be more like midday when the sun was "about" the middle of the sky?"

Yes.  What is your point with regard to the topic?


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## seekeroftruth

rstrats said:


> seekeroftruth,
> re:  "So that Pharisees would continue to test the faith of followers?"
> 
> What's the question that causes your question?



The question that causes my question is this.....  Did you bring up this topic to cause an argument, making yourself look smarter than others like the Pharisees did when they questioned Jesus?




rstrats said:


> re:  "If someone will feed you, heal you, and give you hope.... why would you question them about the hour of the day..."
> 
> That's an issue for a different topic.



I think it's part of the question.  I understand that what day we go to church may matter to some.... but most Christians have Jesus in our lives every single day now.... and we don't care what day or what hour He ascended.  I figure I can ask Him when I get there.... would you like for me to ask Him for you too?



rstrats said:


> re:  "...so doesn't it make sense that when they said midnight they would be talking about the about the middle of the period between dusk and dawn.... wouldn't noon be more like midday when the sun was "about" the middle of the sky?"
> 
> Yes.  What is your point with regard to the topic?



The whole topic was the which day do we consider the first day.... Did Jesus "die" on Wednesday or Thursday?  Was it Saturday or Sunday when they found that empty tomb?  Did Jesus stay for 72 hours or was it 70?  That's what you're discussing.... right?  I say it doesn't matter.... the fact is.... God has figured out how to pull off eternal life..... IMHO.....That's the big deal.... not what day do we go to church to be shot at.....


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## rstrats

seekeroftruth,
re:  "The question that causes my question is this..... Did you bring up this topic to cause an argument, making yourself look smarter than others like the Pharisees did when they questioned Jesus?"

No. 



re:  "I think it's part of the question. I understand that what day we go to church may matter to some...."

That has absolutely nothing to do with this topic.   



re:  "The whole topic was the which day do we consider the first day.... Did Jesus "die" on Wednesday or Thursday? Was it Saturday or Sunday when they found that empty tomb? Did Jesus stay for 72 hours or was it 70? That's what you're discussing.... right?"

No.  Let me repeat:

1. The Messiah said that He would be three days and three nights in the "heart of the earth" 

2. There are those who think that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week with the resurrection taking place on the 1st day of the week.

3. Of those, there are some who think that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb.

4. A 6th day of the week crucifixion/1st day of the week resurrection allows for only 2 nights to be involved. 

5. To account for the lack of a 3rd night, some of those mentioned above say that the Messiah was employing common figure of speech/colloquial language. 

6. I am simply asking anyone who thinks it was common, to provide examples to support that belief; i.e., instances where a daytime or a night time was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of the daytime and/or no part of the night time could have occurred.


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## seekeroftruth

rstrats said:


> 6. I am simply asking anyone who thinks *it was common*, to provide examples to support that belief; i.e., instances where a daytime or a night time was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of the daytime and/or no part of the night time could have occurred.



Maybe the problem is.... we don't understand the question.....  *What was common?*


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## rstrats

seekeroftruth,
re:  "*What was common?*"

To say that it was common to forecast or say that a daytime or a night time would be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could occur.


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## seekeroftruth

rstrats said:


> seekeroftruth,
> re:  "*What was common?*"
> 
> To say that it was common to forecast or say that a daytime or a night time would be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could occur.



I'm sorry... I just don't understand what you are asking.... I don't think Jesus was forecasting anything... I think He was telling the Pharisees that they needed to change their lives as the Ninevites had done when Jonah was sent to them.  Like I said... they didn't have clocks back then... generally so they weren't real specific about time.....


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## rstrats

seekeroftruth,
re:  "I'm sorry... I just don't understand what you are asking.... "

OK, let me repeat:
1. The Messiah said that He would be three days and three nights in the "heart of the earth" 

2. There are those who think that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week with the resurrection taking place on the 1st day of the week.

3. Of those, there are some who think that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb.

4. A 6th day of the week crucifixion/1st day of the week resurrection allows for only 2 nights to be involved. 

5. To account for the lack of a 3rd night, some of those mentioned above say that the Messiah was employing common figure of speech/colloquial language. 

6. I am simply asking anyone who thinks it was common, to provide examples to support that belief; i.e., instances where a daytime or a night time was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of the daytime and/or no part of the night time could have occurred.


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## rstrats

Perhaps someone new visiting this topic may know of examples.


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## warneckutz




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## rstrats

seekeroftruth,

I'm afraid your comments deal with issues for a different topic.  Perhaps you could start one.


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## rstrats

Someone new visiting this topic may know of examples.


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## rstrats

Or maybe not.


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## rstrats

seekeroftruth,
re:  "...they didn't have clocks back then..."

Why is a clock needed to count daytimes and night times?


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## rstrats

I also need to add:  "and who thinks that a calendar day begins at sunset."


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## rstrats

In thinking about it, I realize that it doesn't make any difference with regard to sunset versus sunrise; either way there would still be a lack of a third night with a 6th day of the week crucifixion.


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## rstrats

seekeroftruth,

You have a question directed to you in post #48.


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## rstrats

mudpuddle,
re:  "I read a few of the posts, and was wondering what these posts are all about?"

Most, if not all of the posts have dealt with issues for a different topic.   This one is about one thing and only one thing:

1. The Messiah said that He would be three days and three nights in the "heart of the earth".

2. There are some who think that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week with the resurrection taking place on the 1st day of the week.

3. And of those, there are some who think that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb or at the earliest to the moment when His spirit left His body).

4. However, a 6th day of the week crucifixion/1st day of the week resurrection allows for only 2 nights to be involved.

5. To account for the lack of a 3rd night, there may be some of those mentioned above who try to explain the lack of a 3rd night by saying that the Messiah was using common figure of speech/colloquial language.

6. I'm simply curious if anyone who may fall in the above group of believers might provide examples to support the belief of commonality; i.e., instances where a daytime or a night time was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of a daytime or no part of a night time could have occurred.


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## b23hqb

mudpuddle said:


> why do you need to know the day of the week? What religion or faith do you follow? You are obviously Christian, but what "type" of Christian?


Days mean a lot. E very society takes great care to document events in their history. But, in this case, what day Christ was crucified, really doesn't matter in the scheme of eternity. IT IS NOT AN ISSUE OF SALVATION AND ETERNAL DESTINATION.  The catholic church and their church founders set the date for what they call Good Friday, or the day of the crucifixion. Doesn't mean they are right or wrong. The simple Gospel - that Jesus was born of a virgin, that He was executed, buried, and resurrected Himself from the dead, is the foundation of the Christian belief. I personally lean toward Thursday as the day of the week of His execution myself. I'll find out for sure when I get the opportunity to ask Him in eternity.


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## b23hqb

mudpuddle said:


> what difference would it make to you, if it turns out to be Thursday? How would this affect you, and your beliefs?
> 
> You say, "But, in this case, what day Christ was crucified, really doesn't matter in the scheme of eternity. IT IS NOT AN ISSUE OF SALVATION AND ETERNAL DESTINATION "
> 
> When ARE the dates an issue of salvation and eternal destination? Where do you believe the eternal destination is?



What is your angle here?  Trying to instigate something?:laugh: I've been very clear with my statements -the exact date, either Wed, Thur, or Fri has nothing to do with salvation. The only date that affects an individual regarding salvation is the date that person accepts the Lord Jesus as their savior. That destination is heaven. If one never receives the Lord, then a damnation to hell, and ultimately an eternity in the lake of fire. Don't believe me, look it up for yourself.

* Corinthians 6:2 (NKJV)*   For He says:  "In an acceptable time I have heard you, And in the day of salvation I have helped you."   Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation." Whenever you do it would be your day of salvation, but only while you're breathing. Once you're dead and have not accepted Christ, no escaping hell.

Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

It's on you to make that decision. You decide if you go to heaven or hell. The Gospel is really simple. It is all throughout the NT.


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## rstrats

mudpuddle,
re:  "Who are these 'believers'?"

Anyone who believes the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week, and thinks that the "heart of the earth" refers to the tomb, and tries to explain the lack of a third night by saying that the Messiah was employing common figure of speech/colloquial language of the time.



re:  "Do they have a name?"

I would certainly think so.  Doesn't everyone have a name?



re:  "And what do they believe in?"

That the  crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week, and  that the "heart of the earth" refers to the tomb, and that the Messiah was employing common figure of speech/colloquial language of the time.


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## rstrats

b23hqb,
re:  "...the exact date, either Wed, Thur, or Fri has nothing to do with salvation."

That's an issue for a different topic.


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## rstrats

mudpuddle,
re:  "Thank you for your replies. I simply can not comprehend this information!"

To whom is your post directed and to what information are you referring?


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## rstrats

Since it has been awhile, perhaps someone new visiting this topic may know of examples.


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## rstrats

Point #5 in post #42 should be changed to:  To account for the lack of a 3rd night, there may be some of those mentioned above who say that the Messiah was employing common figure of speech/colloquial language.


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## rstrats

Someone new looking in may know of examples.


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## rstrats

And that "someone new" needs to be someone who believes the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week with a 1st day of the week resurrection, and who thinks that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb, and who tries to explain the lack of a 3rd night by saying that the Messiah was employing common figure of speech/colloquial language of the period.


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## rstrats

THE_GOVERNOR,
re:  "Proof: The question is ... Did jesus pass away before 6 pm wednesday Wednesday to Thursday ... Thursday to friday ... Risen on the 3rd day Saturday sundown"

That is an issue for a different topic.  Perhaps you could start one.


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## rstrats

The OP title and body were poorly conceived with regard to the intent of this topic.  However, it has been clarified in number of subsequent posts; most recently in post #52. :

1. The Messiah said that He would be three days and three nights in the "heart of the earth".

2. There are some who think that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week with the resurrection taking place on the 1st day of the week.

3. And of those, there are some who think that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb or at the earliest to the moment when His spirit left His body).

4. However, a 6th day of the week crucifixion/1st day of the week resurrection allows for only 2 nights to be involved.

5. To account for the lack of a 3rd night, there may be some of those mentioned above who try to explain the lack of a 3rd night by saying that the Messiah was using common figure of speech/colloquial language.

6. I'm simply curious if anyone who may fall in the above group of believers might provide examples to support the belief of commonality, i.e., instances where a daytime or a night time was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of a daytime or no part of a night time could have occurred.


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## rstrats

Since it's been awhile, perhaps someone new visiting this topic may know of examples.


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## rstrats

And again, that "someone new" needs to be someone who believes the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week with a 1st day of the week resurrection, and who thinks that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb, and who tries to explain the lack of a 3rd night by saying that the Messiah was employing common figure of speech/colloquial language of the period.


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## rstrats

Someone new looking in may know of examples.


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## warneckutz

rstrats said:


> Someone new looking in may know of examples.


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## rstrats

warneckutz said:


> Got anything in mind with regard to this topic?


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## rstrats

OOOPS,  I see
warneckutz isn't here anymore.​
But perhaps someone new visiting this topic may know of examples. 
​


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## rstrats

And those examples need to show where a daytime or a night time was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of a daytime or no part of a night time could have occurred.


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